I really dont have a backstory yet, but the prelim 3-view is done. I have a 90% project on the bench now but after paint, we will get started on this one....
Engines from a C-160
Wings from an IL-28
Fuselage from the xf-107
Gear from ??? Sepcat Jag maybe??
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bxoy17WAQvo-emk2eE0tb0lHTXJCNXVqaTR1c0RXRHY1ZUdV/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bxoy17WAQvo-UnFRd1BibXFYazNDRDdHWjBjejFUWVVwS0tZ/view?usp=sharing
Any tips or ideas are greatly welcomed.
(https://www.whatifmodellers.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffile%3A%2F%2F%2FH%3A%2FDesktop%2FNEW%2Fattack%2520concept%2FOriginals%2FHeller%252080353%2520C-160sldvg%2B%2B.JPG&hash=8a828fb5c3eba5b593bae3fbfe589602581663d0)
(https://www.whatifmodellers.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffile%3A%2F%2F%2FH%3A%2FDesktop%2FNEW%2Fattack%2520concept%2FOriginals%2Ffinal%2520prototype.jpg&hash=c93f879bff45df63e8e7fb4367921e5a85066b14)
Do you mean a kind of Bronco or Pucara aircraft? Could you tell us more? (or show your 3-view?) :unsure: ;D
It's kinda tricky to offer tips when we know nothing about your project! So I'll say TPE331s mounted facing rearward, canards obviously.
Sorry, I was having troubles with the attachments.....
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bxoy17WAQvo-emk2eE0tb0lHTXJCNXVqaTR1c0RXRHY1ZUdV/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bxoy17WAQvo-UnFRd1BibXFYazNDRDdHWjBjejFUWVVwS0tZ/view?usp=sharing
That's going to be an interesting bird for sure. Anything that involves turbo prop and C.O.I.N. certainly floats my boat.
Chris.
This looks good and is quite doable. Although, as a former A-7 and OV-10 pilot, I think the canards are to far forward. They interfere with the pilots visibility down to the side.
Agree it's a cool-looking thing. Also about the canards, but again almost all low-wing aircraft can have that criticism leveled.
Unfortunately, there's not very many other places they can go. Maybe a little further back? :unsure:
I wonder if Stuka wings might work? It would save you having to chop something up and get the angles matching.
Looking forward to seeing this progress.
Very Cool Aircraft :mellow: :mellow: :mellow: Looks like it Could be Seen in an Episode of Stingray,Thunderbirds,Captain scarlet,or Joe90! Keep up the Superb Work :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: Hope to see it When You've Brought it To Life in Plastic! Dan
Very cool looking, but make sure you rework the engines to have the intakes in the front and exhausts not facing into the airflow.
Quote from: AeroplaneDriver on January 03, 2019, 08:32:22 PM
Very cool looking, but make sure you rework the engines to have the intakes in the front and exhausts not facing into the airflow.
Agreed! Very cool looking idea but the reversed engine layout is too obviously a "cut-&-paste" of a standard puller-prop design, however all you need to do is put an intake (probably oval-shaped, wider than high) on or near the leading edge to make it look right (I'd probably have vents around the "rear" exhaust duct to draw in outside air to cool the exhaust before it hits the prop blades, too).
:thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Nice concept. The engine nacelle issue has already been mentioned, and from a design point of view: why the long, pointed nose? The aircraft will be subsonic, and hardly carry a radar with a large antenna. Rather an FLIR or a small laser rangefinder. The pilot's field of view is a vital factor for a COIN/low level strike aircraft. IMHO, the cockpit could be moved forward and/or the nose shortened.
Pointy nose is an experimental prototype. ;)
Then give it an extra long sensor boom! ;)
Quote from: Old Wombat on January 03, 2019, 11:14:43 PM
Quote from: AeroplaneDriver on January 03, 2019, 08:32:22 PM
Very cool looking, but make sure you rework the engines to have the intakes in the front and exhausts not facing into the airflow.
Agreed! Very cool looking idea but the reversed engine layout is too obviously a "cut-&-paste" of a standard puller-prop design, however all you need to do is put an intake (probably oval-shaped, wider than high) on or near the leading edge to make it look right (I'd probably have vents around the "rear" exhaust duct to draw in outside air to cool the exhaust before it hits the prop blades, too).
:thumbsup: :thumbsup:
If you use engines from a Hercules then the exhaust port could be your intake.
Here you go. Now everyone can see what everyone is talking about.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/3GL29oFgrfFbfr10mY-TI4PT6yGldjwxv3yyHT1tjPsudsph3oTeo3hVcAN2Ift7TxvI6lYq-uaUsTol-_iKeUiMPfKTkQ=w1270-h655)
Quote from: zenrat on January 04, 2019, 02:03:40 AM
Here you go. Now everyone can see what everyone is talking about.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/3GL29oFgrfFbfr10mY-TI4PT6yGldjwxv3yyHT1tjPsudsph3oTeo3hVcAN2Ift7TxvI6lYq-uaUsTol-_iKeUiMPfKTkQ=w1270-h655)
Nope.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/OiCHnT6fqhEJhT5MErGprxsxp6-MtrRV2EGx-Z25W18TAJyjLS4fBbC6GX-P9ao9nOz3MDZybtCJ9qlJ_si3MbzMljOovA=w3840-h1876)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_shGJu1fKYxtnjgs_CDULGQs9zl87XY-825XpieURBjjWGe_iVUkMbetalMK2pC0r9_4RFtPLlgzEcgJJO4bSCt5heIxtw=w3840-h1876)
That's betterer! :thumbsup:
Quote from: zenrat on January 04, 2019, 02:03:40 AM
Here you go. Now everyone can see what everyone is talking about.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/3GL29oFgrfFbfr10mY-TI4PT6yGldjwxv3yyHT1tjPsudsph3oTeo3hVcAN2Ift7TxvI6lYq-uaUsTol-_iKeUiMPfKTkQ=w1270-h655)
Don't have permission for that, mate. :banghead:
How about, instead:
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/Tzlt_8ILsmgfzdAV3-BtBcC1Jj8wP_xydh63zu5a7XHpRAVUvhQmSZUu2HzIRtqJdGrIrLb-PCLzqQvbOlh1j_h_Ims-aamHhTNQ=w1280-h847)
:thumbsup:
Quote from: Old Wombat on January 04, 2019, 12:22:13 AM
Pointy nose is an experimental prototype. ;)
And a Pointy Nose also looks betterer and cooler... 'sides, if a semi-ground attack aircraft such as the Hawk has a Pointy Radar Nose, why can't this one?
Interesting.
I can see the pics in my post, when Womby quotes it and when Rickshaw quotes it.
But I can't see it when Womby and Rickshaw post it themselves.
Also weird, I can only see the images in my post ... Most peculiar! :unsure:
Quote from: AeroplaneDriver on January 03, 2019, 08:32:22 PM
.....and exhausts not facing into the airflow.
The Handley-Page Heyford's Kestrels had exactly that for some obscure reason. I've never found a rational explanation why they did that.
Quote from: PR19_Kit on January 04, 2019, 05:32:14 AM
Quote from: AeroplaneDriver on January 03, 2019, 08:32:22 PM
.....and exhausts not facing into the airflow.
The Handley-Page Heyford's Kestrels had exactly that for some obscure reason. I've never found a rational explanation why they did that.
Weird. Definitely won't work in a gas turbine though.
After another look at your artwork I think a turretted cannon a'la the OV-10 might be a good option. Possibly even retractable or to go a few years forward even a directed energy weapon. Would take a nice big APU to run the generator but looks like plenty of room.
(https://www.whatifmodellers.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fphotos.smugmug.com%2FBTS-2%2Fi-cmFx2Pz%2F0%2Fac398942%2FX2%2Ffinal%2520prototype-X2.jpg&hash=d41fd11306e1d3c6bc6eaf55d09b4b17ddb39b85)
Put the image up in my SmugMug account as Google Drive doesn't give a proper image share url.
Wow, I really didn't expect that much feedback. THANK YOU ALL!
As for the canards, I haven't really decided where to place them quite yet. I was actually thinking of a spot behind and above the pilot (since he shouldn't be too worried about rearward visibility.) That is an easy issue to deal with when the time comes. As for the engines, the current exhaust port will be the intake and for the exhaust, I might just have it exit the outside aft portion of the nacelle.
With the cockpit, I actually had a preliminary design with a cockpit/forward fuse of a training aircraft and even a KA-50 Attack Helicopter, but I really like the F-107 aesthetics.
For armament a couple 37mm AA guns and a 57mm A/T autocannon should do the job. (Or at least look the part) Those are 1/72 kits as well.
Thanks again for all the awesome feedback. Great Forum!! As soon as I finish my MadMax kitbash, I will get started on this! BTW - where would be the appropriate place to post pictures of a vehicle build like that?
I'd probably put a Mad Max build in Sci-Fi. Thats where a lot of the post-apocalypse stuff here seems to find its home.
Very pleasant design, congratulations!
Quote from: NSXone on January 04, 2019, 03:17:27 PM
for the canards, I haven't really decided where to place them quite yet. I was actually thinking of a spot behind and above the pilot (since he shouldn't be too worried about rearward visibility.) That is an easy issue to deal with when the time comes.
Uh, be informed that some of us are not realists, we are building pleasant objects "like airplanes" but not true-machines to be piloted and used actually, aesthetics may be more important than efficiency! ;D
Quote from: Rick Lowe on January 04, 2019, 02:44:01 AM
Quote from: Old Wombat on January 04, 2019, 12:22:13 AM
Pointy nose is an experimental prototype. ;)
And a Pointy Nose also looks betterer and cooler... 'sides, if a semi-ground attack aircraft such as the Hawk has a Pointy Radar Nose, why can't this one?
There is the same subsonic pointy nose on the German version of the Alpha-Jet. If I remember well, the Heller kit 1/72 propose the 2 nose versions.
Quote from: NSXone on January 04, 2019, 03:17:27 PM
As for the canards, I haven't really decided where to place them quite yet. I was actually thinking of a spot behind and above the pilot (since he shouldn't be too worried about rearward visibility.) That is an easy issue to deal with when the time comes.
The canards should really be at a different level from the wings, looking at the plane side-on. This does, in theory limit where they can be placed, but it's your model, after all.
Maybe just behind & under the rear cockpit window?
I would also think about making the fins a wee bit longer, so they can prevent propeller strike - or make the props a slightly smaller diameter.
Quote from: Tophe on January 04, 2019, 05:37:26 PM
Very pleasant design, congratulations!
Quote from: NSXone on January 04, 2019, 03:17:27 PM
for the canards, I haven't really decided where to place them quite yet. I was actually thinking of a spot behind and above the pilot (since he shouldn't be too worried about rearward visibility.) That is an easy issue to deal with when the time comes.
Uh, be informed that some of us are not realists, we are building pleasant objects "like airplanes" but not true-machines to be piloted and used actually, aesthetics may be more important than efficiency! ;D
...
Absolutely. If it looks right, it is right.
Seeing your model proposal reminded me of the Miles M39 Libellula at the end of WW2. In his book Wings on my sleeve by Captain Eric Winkle Brown RN, he describes the sampler version as having good pilot view if landing on a carrier, and delightful to fly but the canard gave lots of drag.
The version he flew was a scaled version for a larger bomber and not a fighter. Link enclosed..
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miles_M.39B_Libellula
All the input is much appreciated!
I have decided that the canards (actually the Elevators from the f-107) will go wherever is visually most appealing. Who knows, I might just scratch-build some others. I will rework the exhaust ports a bit to look more like an intake. Plus I have to figure out where the armament will be installed.
1 X ZIS-3 76mm Soviet Gun
2 X Soviet 37mm 61K Gun
I'll post some pictures as soon as I start the mock-up......
Quote from: NSXone on January 09, 2019, 09:03:21 AM
1 X ZIS-3 76mm Soviet Gun
2 X Soviet 37mm 61K Gun
Yikes! That's going to be packing some
Serious heat!!
Well I finally finished my other project and started the mock-up. Just tape holding it together until I figure out the fit. Looks pretty good so far, and I wont have to use too much putty. I will be able to keep the rear turret and I decided to use the 107's rudder. The only thing that is scaring me is the landing gear. I would like to try a Mirage or MIG-23 type setup. With the high wing and biiiig props main struts out of the nacelles would be oddly long. Like a Dash 8 long. Anyway, here she is.
I have linked a couple photos
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1n4rwtX49fLQLDbz6_Qtlz-bE2p7i_gi7/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1OMo-3rrqXLJxTVtnrJPaTo3lnPqbkBcf/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/19z-uSwC_nw1UxH_vqrNH9Tw9E2EkNviS/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1_P2ZMvgBUSFMgMeDvbMrRoRJlhPg2G5h/view?usp=sharing
Sexy!
Looks good! :thumbsup:
But does it really need that big tail with the wing-tip fins there?** :unsure:
**: Aesthetic reasons are good enough; I was just curious if you'd contemplated wing-tip rudders as some RW aircraft of similar lay-out have.
That looks bob on that does :thumbsup:
Chris
Quote from: Old Wombat on January 22, 2020, 08:17:36 AM
Looks good! :thumbsup:
But does it really need that big tail with the wing-tip fins there?** :unsure:
**: Aesthetic reasons are good enough; I was just curious if you'd contemplated wing-tip rudders as some RW aircraft of similar lay-out have.
I already cut the rudder to fit the rear turret - so it stays. as for the winglets, I'm kind of 50/50 on them - but I have considered reducing the size (they are actually the F-107 elevators) The whole thing is more form over function at this point, except for all the wing mounted forward firing weapons will have to outboard of the engines, because of canard interference.
Thanks for all the kind words guys. I will keep hacking away and post progress as I'm able.
Woah ! Check that thing out ! Now that is cool. Love just about everything about it, the layout, the canards, the pusher props....that sexy shape ! Nice one !
:cheers: :bow: :party:
Thank you Capt. Canada!
Sexy. Looks very Macross-ish
:wub: Very elegant shape, congratulations! :thumbsup:
Nice.
:thumbsup:
Oooooooh that is cooool!!! I want one!
This is fantastic, it really appeals to a lot of my aesthetics. Will be keeping an eye on it!