As "other worlds" is accepted, got in touch with the mods around using a part started (barely started and junked more like it) kit that I found on the street. Got the official okey dokey.
Big fan of Rodney Matthews Art from the 70's, so using his Ice Spirit as inspiration
(https://www.enworld.org/media/rodney-matthews-ice-ship-jpg.104114/full)
Say 20 years back I did this based on the even older Imai Roman Warship.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/8pmyu2qfwhmc0vnfnynh7/icewolf_1.jpg?rlkey=7pfwf06le99mwtndtbfuu3qj9&st=xdolpe0p&raw=1)
So using this "street find" of the hull of a ship kit, of something, I plan to do an updated version of the Ice Rigger
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/fk707fhh477hi0kxbo65u/PolarGB-idea_1.JPG?rlkey=s07behj48rkojku35fh1dcdoa&st=hqkenlr5&raw=1)
Found this in a pile of toys on the nature strip, cannot walk past a model, no matter what the condition.
So basically same sort of format (because I like it ;D ) of a ship hull on ice skates. Lots of thinking to do around scale and layout, but the though bubble is there
:thumbsup:
looking forward to following this
Intrestin'. :thumbsup:
Yeah this has me quite interested to...seriously interested 😄
Had a fair few of Matthews' posters floating around the unit when I was in my early-20's, will be very interested to see where this goes. :thumbsup:
Having read the Icerigger Trilogy I approved this build.
:thumbsup:
Thanks for the support so far.. hopefully I can make something of this.
Some bench time so out comes the razor saw and the clamps
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/axxwmxlbtbhoih5yuxk4i/IceRigger_1.JPG?rlkey=sk3fj68bjobm43hth43gk02mm&st=idpx68m9&raw=1)
Working a couple of thought bubbles on Sails, to sort of look not like normal sails if possible. Found a very cheap fan to test some thoughts
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/0t0ukuxdpbf47ldnlphaq/IceRigger_2.JPG?rlkey=8cju86d65aaldog35d7oiw58u&st=vp2olcts&raw=1)
Test fit of one option, this is very rough, skewer yards are too long, sails too far out, etc etc so bear that in mind whilst I play around with some options like Lanteen Sails.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/7yowss5ntf0de6l0j37r8/IceRigger_3.JPG?rlkey=0cspfurh91go91w20rodass9i&st=o6s9bqu4&raw=1)
Of course there is always the Sails furled option to make the whole thing go away. I would image it would look cooler with sails set though.
Got a 3D print running now to try out a Stern Castle design as well. More to follow. Wait out. ;D
Dude that's already looking rad 😎 👌
And that's just the prelim :thumbsup:
Those "sails" certainly give her an Oriental look. Like some junks and sampans :thumbsup:
:thumbsup: :thumbsup:
:thumbsup:
Don't forget some way of stopping and some way of holding her fast during a storm. Big knarly fishhooks on the end of chains might work well in that scale.
I rather like Matthews' bird-wing sails but the fan-sails hold some considerable promise, especially if they join to the yards at/near the mast & fan down.
Keep up the good thinking, BT! :thumbsup:
Quote from: NARSES2 on November 03, 2024, 01:07:55 AMThose "sails" certainly give her an Oriental look. Like some junks and sampans :thumbsup:
I was thinking similar, looks great.
Quote from: buzzbomb on November 03, 2024, 01:27:37 AMWorking a couple of thought bubbles on Sails, to sort of look not like normal sails if possible. Found a very cheap fan to test some thoughts
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/0t0ukuxdpbf47ldnlphaq/IceRigger_2.JPG?rlkey=8cju86d65aaldog35d7oiw58u&st=vp2olcts&raw=1)
You could stick with the fan idea. Have a boom attached at right angles to the mast, with stems at a pivot like a fan. E
Something different but familiar at same time, rifting on the junk aesthetic. Something like this:
71WvaikYlAL~3.jpg
Very cool. Looking forward to seeing more !
For those who don't know, the Ice Spirit is the Ice Schooner from the excellent novel of that name by Michael Moorcock.
Looking forward to this.
Now, where's that Hawkwind album in the "X" sleeve I picked up in a charity shop last month?
This reminds me of Icerigger by Alan Dean Foster, now I am going to have to find out if there were any sequels.
Gondor
Quote from: Gondor on November 03, 2024, 07:27:04 AMThis reminds me of Icerigger by Alan Dean Foster, now I am going to have to find out if there were any sequels.
Gondor
There was one; Mission to Moulokin.
Of course there were a bunch of books set in his Humanx Commonwealth
Quote from: Doug K on November 03, 2024, 09:10:26 AMQuote from: Gondor on November 03, 2024, 07:27:04 AMThis reminds me of Icerigger by Alan Dean Foster, now I am going to have to find out if there were any sequels.
Gondor
There was one; Mission to Moulokin.
Of course there were a bunch of books set in his Humanx Commonwealth
I found out that there are two, "Mission to Moulokin" and "The Deluge Drivers". Both are now on my Amazon wish list. I shall expand into his Humanx Commonwealth once I have read those two.
Quote from: steelpillow on November 03, 2024, 07:19:39 AM...where's that Hawkwind album in the "X" sleeve I picked up in a charity shop last month?
In Search of Space?
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/fb/In_Search_of_Space_-_Hawkwind.jpg)
Quote from: Gondor on November 03, 2024, 10:05:42 AMQuote from: Doug K on November 03, 2024, 09:10:26 AMQuote from: Gondor on November 03, 2024, 07:27:04 AMThis reminds me of Icerigger by Alan Dean Foster, now I am going to have to find out if there were any sequels.
Gondor
There was one; Mission to Moulokin.
Of course there were a bunch of books set in his Humanx Commonwealth
I found out that there are two, "Mission to Moulokin" and "The Deluge Drivers". Both are now on my Amazon wish list. I shall expand into his Humanx Commonwealth once I have read those two.
IMO Icerigger is the best of the three. The survival aspect (after the crash) adds something the others lack. Although having said that they are all a good read.
Quote from: zenrat on November 04, 2024, 04:00:17 AMQuote from: steelpillow on November 03, 2024, 07:19:39 AM...where's that Hawkwind album in the "X" sleeve I picked up in a charity shop last month?
In Search of Space?
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/fb/In_Search_of_Space_-_Hawkwind.jpg)
Yes, that's it.
I was in search of In Search of Space. :laugh:
Maybe something like this on skids or skates (but built so that it is likely to stay upright)?
wasa1.jpg
------
... Does an ice ship need to have only upright masts? Masts angled to the sides might not be the best for sailing into the wind though.
Quote from: Gondor on November 03, 2024, 10:05:42 AMQuote from: Doug K on November 03, 2024, 09:10:26 AMQuote from: Gondor on November 03, 2024, 07:27:04 AMThis reminds me of Icerigger by Alan Dean Foster, now I am going to have to find out if there were any sequels.
Gondor
There was one; Mission to Moulokin.
Of course there were a bunch of books set in his Humanx Commonwealth
I found out that there are two, "Mission to Moulokin" and "The Deluge Drivers". Both are now on my Amazon wish list. I shall expand into his Humanx Commonwealth once I have read those two.
I forgot about the Deluge Drivers!
Good Stuff. Not read Ice Rigger, but have done the Michael Moorcock novel.
So, leaving the sails aside, until I get a vibe on the hull shape, time to tinker with the hull.
A bit of 3D design work on the bow castle, for wont of a better name at this stage. I have already cobbled up a proof of concept for the Stern.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/e7c2koeim4fplrkuubt1w/IceRigger_4.JPG?rlkey=xhbo1xr9aifx1xcbf9o1n6pui&st=8efqv2xi&raw=1)
A an hour or two of printing, a test fit to see if the vibe works, and pretty much, this will probably do.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/vhal8aq5cs6jnabg0gr1f/IceRigger_5.JPG?rlkey=a84oj3v5kyb9ag4dyjq7hfqjb&st=n5u6w8wp&raw=1)
Also completed a hull bottom piece a lot shallower
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/nif1gti87khhmfq8hl2r1/IceRigger_6.JPG?rlkey=p8btzvh4h2jsjhgb4reonsbqq&st=0nlooyg4&raw=1)
So get this into place, then see what happens next I suppose
It's looking pretty good so far Buzzy mate .. this has got me even more interested now ;D ;D
Coming along! :thumbsup:
I like Foster's Humanx serieses, but haven't read them in years. And back then I read too many at once, trying to get the whole story, so got a bit tired of them and stopped.
Quote from: buzzbomb on November 05, 2024, 08:28:43 PMA bit of 3D design work on the bow castle, for wont of a better name at this stage.
The official term is "
forecastle" (a.k.a. "fo'c's'le" (Eng)/"fo'c'sle" (US Eng)), the similar structure at the stern is called the "aftercastle" (a.k.a "sterncastle"/"aftcastle").
Nice work thus far, BT! :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Quote from: buzzbomb on November 05, 2024, 08:28:43 PMthe bow castle, for wont of a better name at this stage.
There's always some annoying knowall on a forum. Allow me to inform you that it is the fo'c'sle, a contraction of forecastle. The one at the stern is the poop, surmounted by the poop deck(reputedly derived from some French word for stern).
Quote from: steelpillow on November 06, 2024, 11:57:55 AMQuote from: buzzbomb on November 05, 2024, 08:28:43 PMthe bow castle, for wont of a better name at this stage.
There's always some annoying knowall on a forum. Allow me to inform you that it is the fo'c'sle, a contraction of forecastle. The one at the stern is the poop, surmounted by the poop deck(reputedly derived from some French word for stern).
Which has nothing to do with the head! So I've been told.... ;D ;)
Quote from: buzzbomb on November 05, 2024, 08:28:43 PMA an hour or two of printing, a test fit to see if the vibe works, and pretty much, this will probably do.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/vhal8aq5cs6jnabg0gr1f/IceRigger_5.JPG?rlkey=a84oj3v5kyb9ag4dyjq7hfqjb&st=n5u6w8wp&raw=1)
It seems somewhat top-heavy. Remember the Wasa!
Quote from: loupgarou on November 07, 2024, 12:24:11 AMQuote from: buzzbomb on November 05, 2024, 08:28:43 PMA an hour or two of printing, a test fit to see if the vibe works, and pretty much, this will probably do.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/vhal8aq5cs6jnabg0gr1f/IceRigger_5.JPG?rlkey=a84oj3v5kyb9ag4dyjq7hfqjb&st=n5u6w8wp&raw=1)
It seems somewhat top-heavy. Remember the Wasa!
Yep I know the Wasa Lou...one amazing wreck ..my dad loved his sailing ships but there's one thing here where this might not be a problem..this ship is on ice and it's got I think out riggers .
Quote from: kerick on November 06, 2024, 05:13:53 PMQuote from: steelpillow on November 06, 2024, 11:57:55 AMQuote from: buzzbomb on November 05, 2024, 08:28:43 PMthe bow castle, for wont of a better name at this stage.
There's always some annoying knowall on a forum. Allow me to inform you that it is the fo'c'sle, a contraction of forecastle. The one at the stern is the poop, surmounted by the poop deck(reputedly derived from some French word for stern).
Which has nothing to do with the head! So I've been told.... ;D ;)
I had the same thoughts ;D
Been a while, I have been working on some Shelf Queens, so finally finished the HMS Astute and a pair of Airborne Jeeps that have been 2-3years in a box.
Back to the Slider. I think we have covered off that capsizing might not be the greatest risk this vessel faces in the icy Polar wastes.
Quote from: Old Wombat on November 06, 2024, 06:45:02 AMQuote from: buzzbomb on November 05, 2024, 08:28:43 PMA bit of 3D design work on the bow castle, for wont of a better name at this stage.
The official term is "forecastle" (a.k.a. "fo'c's'le" (Eng)/"fo'c'sle" (US Eng)), the similar structure at the stern is called the "aftercastle" (a.k.a "sterncastle"/"aftcastle").
thanks Guy, my brain had clearly gone to mush when I was doing that update
A couple of mods on the Sterncastle adding a some bits to the 3D print, but needed the heavy duty excess stuff removers to aid in getting them to sit flat(er)
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/otc3c1ol27g3b60c98wu3/IceRigger_7.JPG?rlkey=q5uvscb9hd4twd8a7k3i2n206&st=q8z8h0hz&raw=1)
Now getting the riggers into a proof of concept mode, that works for me, so some more 3D design work on the supports and some initial gap filling
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/akz6jmwpsswnks8difduj/IceRigger_8.JPG?rlkey=50gx4dy7ypiq5lez2kn8kg85j&st=d3kyznv9&raw=1)
I found cutting a slot and fairing around method to be better than trying to work out the angles and slopes to cut the supports to suit the hull.
It is good to have a bigger tool in spare :thumbsup:
And that's a big ship you create, very fine.
I think it would be good to make the shape of the blades the same direction at front and the rear, the round back is far to simple for the ship, just my mind.
That's looking sweet Buzzy mate 👍...liking it more everytime I see it 😀
Quote from: buzzbomb on November 16, 2024, 09:55:18 PMQuote from: Old Wombat on November 06, 2024, 06:45:02 AMQuote from: buzzbomb on November 05, 2024, 08:28:43 PMA bit of 3D design work on the bow castle, for wont of a better name at this stage.
The official term is "forecastle" (a.k.a. "fo'c's'le" (Eng)/"fo'c'sle" (US Eng)), the similar structure at the stern is called the "aftercastle" (a.k.a "sterncastle"/"aftcastle").
thanks Guy, my brain had clearly gone to mush when I was doing that update
No prob's, mate! Navy service vs Army service. ;)
More work, using the 3D printer more on this, getting lazy ;D
Stern windows
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/j651v8o1t78e2vyj2esud/IceRigger_9.JPG?rlkey=6b2adjwc03ykhzr8ozogulqil&st=jrrroaeo&raw=1)
New Bridge area
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/ozuzholisos2ggs03maaj/IceRigger_10.JPG?rlkey=t406nonq47ksp0jgt96riukm5&st=3hxxza6j&raw=1)
Decided that I needed a Dragon Skull as a figurehead, so more 3D scaling and printing. Bit of clean up to go, PLA gets a bet furry, so needs to remove some dags.
And fix a wonky tooth.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/z2f3hzfrbg3pd124s23oh/IceRigger_11.JPG?rlkey=rq4ck5vwg9tow5g3zomshzuol&st=bs35hdoi&raw=1)
Also experimenting with using the 3D printer for railing. So far.. a bit ho hum so more on that.
I can see lots and lots of bits that need to be cleaned up and finessed as well. But not in Hammer of Thor zone yet
Brian mate that's so cool 😎 👌
Depending who owns this craft if leave the cockeyed tooth as it would look more towards a roughly looked after vessel..if she's been well looked after then by all means ;D
It seems the hard work on 3D printing is the clean up of the parts. Are you going to fill all of that or cover some of it with sheet plastic?
The imagination is in high gear on this one!
Quote from: Wardukw on November 20, 2024, 08:27:41 PMBrian mate that's so cool 😎 👌
Depending who owns this craft if leave the cockeyed tooth as it would look more towards a roughly looked after vessel..if she's been well looked after then by all means ;D
Well, if it's a
real dragon's skull, maybe it
had a wonky tooth! ;) :thumbsup:
I am liking this. :wub:
Quote from: Old Wombat on November 21, 2024, 03:53:25 AMQuote from: Wardukw on November 20, 2024, 08:27:41 PMBrian mate that's so cool 😎 👌
Depending who owns this craft if leave the cockeyed tooth as it would look more towards a roughly looked after vessel..if she's been well looked after then by all means ;D
Well, if it's a real dragon's skull, maybe it had a wonky tooth! ;) :thumbsup:
True... or it got that way, when said dragon was in the process of becoming a figurehead.
Quote from: buzzbomb on November 20, 2024, 08:22:06 PMDecided that I needed a Dragon Skull as a figurehead, so more 3D scaling and printing. Bit of clean up to go, PLA gets a bet furry, so needs to remove some dags.
And fix a wonky tooth.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/z2f3hzfrbg3pd124s23oh/IceRigger_11.JPG?rlkey=rq4ck5vwg9tow5g3zomshzuol&st=bs35hdoi&raw=1)
You're going to be in trouble. You killed one of House Targaryen's dragons. :o They're not going to like that.
Thanks for the kind words so far
Quote from: seadude on November 24, 2024, 12:17:00 PMYou're going to be in trouble. You killed one of House Targaryen's dragons. :o They're not going to like that.
Honestly your Lordship, it was just lying around on the Tundra ;D
Turned one of the corners of the build, nearing the end of the hull stage development. This is just about it. Still lots and lots of tidy ups to do.
Sort of settled on a scale as well, I have some N Scale figures.... that will do, so somewhere in the 1/144 - 1/160 zone, depending who's figures you have. Thats the figure.. the tiny dude in white near the mainmast.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/otmsqqypn3sdzc95d7sxp/IceRigger_12.JPG?rlkey=z9pm0mwxifvys1ahchgcdo6az&st=1righsnu&raw=1)
Here be Dragons. The teeth need to be replaced as one of the defurring PLA options is a quick run over with a flame, which also, incidentally, melts dragon teeth, which is quite ironic ;D
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/vxfygs4h0tcjw1zvgr3qx/IceRigger_13.JPG?rlkey=rmr872gpfw38jv0nqhz6utqid&st=irjrw53t&raw=1)
Tried out the 3D printed railing, one of the good things is it bends nicely. For this build, to keep costs down on buying brass, this might be the go. Well at this stage anyway.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/j4g4do738xnlznsdzphws/IceRigger_14.JPG?rlkey=b5l79ubwxupnahdnh1n4drgld&st=6pbavx1z&raw=1)
Slight half profile overhead shot of basic layout
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/o4pwtl2imkcpsfc4b1cw4/IceRigger_15.JPG?rlkey=om3nmazaq143mwe2a7hv7bdi9&st=4bs5boun&raw=1)
Started tinkerings with the masts to help with layout options. Moving forward on that when the mojo returns
:thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Wow ! Those are some really great details. How awesome to be able to print your own like that. Excellent !
I need to invest in some of those heavy duty excess stuff removers lol
Cheers !
That's coming along nicely. :thumbsup:
The scale looks about right, too.
And nice idea with the railings. :thumbsup:
I've just seen the pics and it's great 👍
That little dude really helps give a good idea of its size ..it's bigger than you'd think 🙂
... and we are back. ;)
Got into the masts and yards. Using bamboo skewers for both, easy to work with and shape, so far anyway. At trial fit stage for sizing and layout. Might get more yards with slimmer sails more like the Ice Spirit inspiration image.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/gfyprn3pckjc5isnclnbh/IceRigger_16.JPG?rlkey=puhxm8e6s4phrncq6tdzs58ir&st=nzn0s97c&raw=1)
Because it is a fantasy build..a BFG on a rotating table. Sort of makes it a Monitor. Got some swivel guns ex the Airfix Revenge, that may fit out around the vessel as well
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/5fm024krf4xnu1drvuw4s/IceRigger_17.JPG?rlkey=5kb3swsjhglly3eaghv6b271n&st=nyrs633o&raw=1)
More detail for the Dragons Skull, bit of maybe flame work.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/fkam320j58a1odwfu3kkj/IceRigger_18.JPG?rlkey=v1v90w6p7boj1sun9dm6azvg9&st=kf2yrxg6&raw=1)
Now trying to work out how the Sails might work. Not going this shape, but interesting to experiment on how it might be done using paper. Much more work in this space.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/ae3zxwtjz0jjn8io0prgv/IceRigger_19.JPG?rlkey=voeg63f31df6yxv9e8dvn54qe&st=8yad1aey&raw=1)
Brian that looks sweet 😋 😍
An idea for your sails ..since you want it moving by the look of it try tissue paper and thinned out OVA glue..find a plastic bottle to get the shape ya want ..
Lay the paper in the bottle or plastic sheet styrene..soak it with ghe thinned glue ..let it dry..it won't stick to the plastic and will hold it's shape once dry .
It might look good or it might suck ;D
Oh use the best quality tissues too..there not fluffy like the cheap ones :thumbsup:
Looking good :thumbsup:
Quote from: buzzbomb on December 20, 2024, 09:16:26 PM.
More detail for the Dragons Skull, bit of maybe flame work.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/fkam320j58a1odwfu3kkj/IceRigger_18.JPG?rlkey=v1v90w6p7boj1sun9dm6azvg9&st=kf2yrxg6&raw=1)
Maybe the Dragons Skull could be a flame thrower using Greek Fire ?
... to melt that ice ?
That thing looks great.
:thumbsup:
:thumbsup: :mellow: :mellow:
It's an ice ship, but........it has a dragon skull on the bow front.
So I have to wonder: Who gets to helm this ship? Daenerys Targaryen or Jon Snow? Or both?
;D ;D ;D
Three sails per mast looks better than two. Is three enough? :wacko:
Coming along nicely. :thumbsup:
Wow, this is epic!! The masts really make it come alive!
Quote from: sandiego89 on December 22, 2024, 02:36:09 PMWow, this is epic!! The masts really make it come alive!
This! :thumbsup:
But should I point out that real spars are not parallel-edged; that they actually taper from the mast out to the tips? :unsure:
Quote from: Old Wombat on December 22, 2024, 04:18:36 PMQuote from: sandiego89 on December 22, 2024, 02:36:09 PMWow, this is epic!! The masts really make it come alive!
This! :thumbsup:
But should I point out that real spars are not parallel-edged; that they actually taper from the mast out to the tips? :unsure:
Yes. they are. But not in this universe.
Trying to achieve that would invariably put this build in the bin. I am in the area where the materials I have chosen is a compromise as to the amount of effort to produce something that is more accurate is project killing, than just trying to "get the point across".
I do have a set of plastic Yards, from a previous build, but not enough, not long enough, not strong enough and requiring too much modification.
Quote from: buzzbomb on December 23, 2024, 01:24:11 PMQuote from: Old Wombat on December 22, 2024, 04:18:36 PMBut should I point out that real spars are not parallel-edged; that they actually taper from the mast out to the tips? :unsure:
Yes. they are. But not in this universe.
The convention in this culture is to build the spars hollow, as this is lighter than a solid spar of the same strength.
The inner diameter is tapered instead, with the wall thinnest at the ends.
It is done this way to allow the use of standard fittings across the span of the spar, greatly easing maintenance and repairs when out and away on the wild ice.
Quote from: steelpillow on December 24, 2024, 01:02:53 AMThe convention in this culture is to build the spars hollow, as this is lighter than a solid spar of the same strength.
The inner diameter is tapered instead, with the wall thinnest at the ends.
It is done this way to allow the use of standard fittings across the span of the spar, greatly easing maintenance and repairs when out and away on the wild ice.
EXACTLY!
Kit's 2nd Rule ALWAYS applies. ;D
Quote from: steelpillow on December 24, 2024, 01:02:53 AMQuote from: buzzbomb on December 23, 2024, 01:24:11 PMQuote from: Old Wombat on December 22, 2024, 04:18:36 PMBut should I point out that real spars are not parallel-edged; that they actually taper from the mast out to the tips? :unsure:
Yes. they are. But not in this universe.
The convention in this culture is to build the spars hollow, as this is lighter than a solid spar of the same strength.
The inner diameter is tapered instead, with the wall thinnest at the ends.
It is done this way to allow the use of standard fittings across the span of the spar, greatly easing maintenance and repairs when out and away on the wild ice.
I like the way you think ;D
Bit of minor work on the BFG, this is now a breech loading smoothbore, with semi automated loading mechanism. Yes, yes.. lots of reasons why this will not work. Except in this universe ;D
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/g2m85d9vs98t4sztgmnnz/IceRigger_20.JPG?rlkey=knq8ivyq7ivqzo4kkqy62a0kr&st=5zgqwgkc&raw=1)
Steps, rails
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/fq02v4bmag7kwaci98ji7/IceRigger_21.JPG?rlkey=l8nmaf5mgzi3mblfb7j5p4620&st=tsgr0bjq&raw=1)
Some more substantial work around the building up the sails. Next will be fitting these off, plus lots and lots of ropes which may or may not actually look like they do what they are supposed to do.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/wqugy1kgumui7dd43h7rt/IceRigger_22.JPG?rlkey=cqe4pq9821yt4nmashoaax1ol&st=5y6vafkx&raw=1)
Thought about Dukw's suggestion on tissue paper, white glue which was quite sound. Ended up using the path of least effort and using paper.
Coming along well. ; impressive beast. :thumbsup:
Yeah, the lines will take you longer than you think,.
And tightening one up will loosen the one you installed previously... ask me how I know... :banghead:
There are PE ratlines available, which could be your best bet for those.
Maybe rotate the spars so they're not at
90° to centreline of the ship? That's how
squareriggers are able to sail into the
wind and it's visually more interesting IMHO. The spars are only perpendicular when running with the wind.
I read the Foster books decades back and the biggest question I had was: how would you tack a large windjammer ice ship?
The majority of iceboats have a triangular skate layout, one fwd., two aft or vice versa, which enables the boat to tack.
Quote from: jcf on December 27, 2024, 03:10:06 PMMaybe rotate the spars so they're not at 90° to centreline of the ship? That's how squareriggers are able to sail into the
wind and it's visually more interesting IMHO. The spars are only perpendicular when running with the wind.
I read the Foster books decades back and the biggest question I had was: how would you tack a large windjammer ice ship?
The majority of iceboats have a triangular skate layout, one fwd., two aft or vice versa, which enables the boat to tack.
Yeah, I'd agree with the not-at-90-degrees thing.
As to the steering, maybe have the front, or both front and rear skates separate from the middle ones and able to turn?
And the Foster books are still good, IMHO - worth a re-read. Hmmm.
Quote from: Rick Lowe on December 28, 2024, 11:06:22 AMQuote from: jcf on December 27, 2024, 03:10:06 PMThe majority of iceboats have a triangular skate layout, one fwd., two aft or vice versa, which enables the boat to tack.
As to the steering, maybe have the front, or both front and rear skates separate from the middle ones and able to turn?
Modern ice yachts have one fixed pair of side runners, and a central steering runner at either bow or stern to taste.
A land skiddoo has its drive at the back and twin steering runners at the front.
Seems to me that this beauty would benefit from twin steering bow runners. If it were me, I'd pivot each separately, beneath its own outrigger.
But this one isn't me. ;D
Maybe it has rows of Discworld Gnomes inside the bow runners, all trained/enslaved to run sideways on command. Or they are Luggage runners. Or something....
The large sea-going junks had a large rudder that could be raised and lowered. The primary use was to enable entrance into river deltas, shallow bays etc., but t was also, under some conditions, used while under sail in deeper waters.
Perhaps a fwd. mounted "steering skate" that is lowered when necessary, but is pulled up against the keel when not in use. I suppose it could be mounted so that the leading point sticks out like a ram when retracted.
;D
As a sidebar, contrary to the usual notions, junks didn't always just stay close to shore and they do well sailing into the wind. Junk rig is very adjustable and the battened sails are similar in function to "wing sails". The fore-and-aft angle against the mast and the camber of the sail can be altered at will.
Quote from: Rick Lowe on December 28, 2024, 11:06:22 AMQuote from: jcf on December 27, 2024, 03:10:06 PMMaybe rotate the spars so they're not at 90° to centreline of the ship? That's how squareriggers are able to sail into the
wind and it's visually more interesting IMHO. The spars are only perpendicular when running with the wind.
I read the Foster books decades back and the biggest question I had was: how would you tack a large windjammer ice ship?
The majority of iceboats have a triangular skate layout, one fwd., two aft or vice versa, which enables the boat to tack.
Yeah, I'd agree with the not-at-90-degrees thing.
As to the steering, maybe have the front, or both front and rear skates separate from the middle ones and able to turn?
And the Foster books are still good, IMHO - worth a re-read. Hmmm.
Bear this in mind when they actually get fitted, rather than just plonked on for an in progress shot and to store them between sessions.
As to steering, originally was going to do the ice Steering oars, like the source image, but with the input of folks who definitely know more about ice vehicles than I do, maybe some other method that does not require a complete re-engineering of the build from where it is. Perhaps Ice anchors on each side, like the way a tank steers.
I have ice skated two or three times, so my actual time on skatey type things is very limited. Living is Aust has its life experiences you do miss out on ;)
Anyhoo, short session to fit some rails. Going the 3D printed versions, bit chunkier, but far cheaper and more convenient than the PE versions I do not have
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/57ukt97kzci3dhwjl9owv/IceRigger_23.JPG?rlkey=op18vgruy5ojkzvjxvhs2yffu&st=vbm8i80q&raw=1)
Those railings look fine to me. :thumbsup:
Maybe you could also print the ratlines? Just multi-strand tapered triangles, with lines across them in the middle.
Thick railings to run steam through them to prevent this;
(https://i.makeagif.com/save/U8t_Rd)
I recommend one or more steerable skates/runners. Just like boats have rudders and cars have steerable wheels. Not just to turn but, on occasion, maintain direction when conditions and balance are not just right.
Quote from: perttime on December 28, 2024, 08:43:56 PMI recommend one or more steerable skates/runners. Just like boats have rudders and cars have steerable wheels. Not just to turn but, on occasion, maintain direction when conditions and balance are not just right.
Yep, and like a car front rather than rear steering. Steering from the rear isn't
advisable on a hard surface for anything
faster than a forklift*.
;D
The huge herds of giant Zamboni slugs
that keep the ice smooth would be quite
the sight to see.
*Yes, I know about ThrustSSC, and that it
was Andy Green's least favourite feature of
the monster.
Quote from: jcf on December 29, 2024, 10:18:56 AMThe huge herds of giant Zamboni slugs
that keep the ice smooth would be quite
the sight to see.
;D
I know absolute doodoo about ships and how they sail and steer into the wind and all that but this thing just keeps getting better and better everytime I see it ;D :thumbsup:
A bit of the end is nigh happening... so finally getting some paint on, before the mojo to finish this completely disappears
Getting some base colours down, with lots of fix up to go.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/t9drco1nwflz2x2y96h5y/IceRigger_24.JPG?rlkey=4q1jstpu8ghknm2eo70zuo9bk&st=58ngotoz&raw=1)
Sorry for the pretty average photo, another thing about getting all the gear out, that mojo is low too.
Nice! :thumbsup:
Really starts to pull it together. Excellent.
It is coming to life! :thumbsup:
All the decks look cool (no idea what they are for ;D ) and the colours fit an icy environment.
I really like this build - looking very good. :)
The purpose of the high fore-castle was to allow archers to shoot down into enemy ships, to kill their sailors & Marines. The aft-castle had the same purpose, but also to give the steersman a good view forward. The steering deck was usually only about 25% as long as the main deck - the "quarterdeck." And since the officers had to be able to give voice orders to the helmsman quickly and clearly, they generally were stationed near him, leading to the quarterdeck becoming the command centre.
The cat-heads, or 'heads - where the anchors were attached, up next to the fore-castle, were where one went to perform bathroom functions - all smelly things were placed as far forward as possible so the following winds would take the stink with them ... The galley was nearby. :P A nasty smell was a pretty certain sign of a ship upwind of you ... IIRC, cattle ships and slavers smelt the worst of all sailing vessels.
I love Alan Dean Fosters "Icerigger" trilogy, and have read it several times. IIRC, that ice-rigger was flat-bottomed - I was thinking that you'd do better with one of those 'water-line' models ... Do they make them for sailing ships? It was also a trading vessel, so no high fore-castle. I do not recall how it steered.
Quote from: Scotaidh on January 11, 2025, 07:02:54 AMI love Alan Dean Fosters "Icerigger" trilogy, and have read it several times. IIRC, that ice-rigger was flat-bottomed - I was thinking that you'd do better with one of those 'water-line' models ... Do they make them for sailing ships? It was also a trading vessel, so no high fore-castle. I do not recall how it steered.
Good books, I agree.
IIIRC, it was sails and a steering ski, as here.
Model is looking good too. :thumbsup:
Thanks guys.
So a bit of paint shop work, before tackling the sails and rigging
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/j41w1fuk03snjx5lqv1bg/IceRigger_25.JPG?rlkey=cbzpmdhelq75mkvmpquxyvppl&st=0p6us2sh&raw=1)
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/yn7tamdwqoojjruouf8es/IceRigger_26.JPG?rlkey=eqpo3zsqtuk8fjglv7pqpzkv7&st=fhl5xzf4&raw=1)
There is a bit of painting outside of the lines, that needs some attention, so I see.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/26byi0o4ldrlxfucc4rt0/IceRigger_27.JPG?rlkey=9bnvghvrdr45u2ih18khfb06i&st=fricepq6&raw=1)
Wow! Stunning is not enough to describe this beauty. Really coming to life.
And I love the grappling rudders and fore-runner sprung pivots, really neat.
Looks almost elegant in that scheme. :thumbsup:
Quote from: PR19_Kit on January 14, 2025, 02:34:22 AMLooks almost elegant in that scheme. :thumbsup:
It does look pretty damn amazing for certain 😍 👌
With the end being nigh.... the end is nigh for the this build
Few final bits and fix ups after a mind change on gun placement that should have happened at step one
A couple of teasers
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/hzta74s8iaum52r4iseo1/IceRigger_28.JPG?rlkey=i91m5i84p7f8idoh4cj3ho9by&st=8dyc6jfv&raw=1)
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/xwmmxsvibnwa4ai32tanm/IceRigger_29.JPG?rlkey=4ow3w25n1v94zvfqe65wg0foi&st=b68af996&raw=1)
Truly superb. :mellow: :thumbsup: :bow:
Give us more pix, you know you want to! :party:
Quote from: steelpillow on January 24, 2025, 06:07:56 PMTruly superb. :mellow: :thumbsup: :bow:
It really is :bow: :bow:
Ok... how did you make the sails? :thumbsup:
I was wondering about the guns: can you aim and hit unfriendlies, without also hitting the ship's own rigging and other structures?
Excellent!
Wow. The guys are right, this is truly amazing ! Every time you look at it you see a little more detail. Really gets the imagination flowing. Great work !
Quote from: perttime on January 25, 2025, 11:43:32 AMI was wondering about the guns: can you aim and hit unfriendlies, without also hitting the ship's own rigging and other structures?
The small outboard guns, easy, nothing's in the way, the large central gun appears to be on a turn-table
* &, as they used to be able to fire various carronades & the like from the middle of the deck, it's doable (remembering that real sail-powered warships had a
lot more rigging that this).
[
*: RW, the vast majority of traversable guns were mounted on a pivot & "rail" system (see below).]
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Carronade-tag.svg/660px-Carronade-tag.svg.png)
I can't find an image of the deck "rails" but Drachinifel covered them well in one of his videos (no, I can't remember which one, or I'd link it).
Nice! :thumbsup:
And yes, we want more photos!! (Pretty Please?) ;)
Quote from: Rick Lowe on January 25, 2025, 05:33:46 PMNice! :thumbsup:
And yes, we want more photos!! (Pretty Please?) ;)
Ok ;D Fixing some last minute stuff.
So a bit of lets pretend on some stuff
Like, there is a lot more rigging than there is presented and there is some sort of deadeyes, blocks and sheaves system, that clearly I did not have the oompf to scratchbuild. I have a bundle of 1/72 ish deadeyes but at this scale they looked absurd, so better to leave them out.
There is a rudimentary steering for the front runners, rather huge turning circle but I am sure that the actual operators of a vessel like this would work something out.
And yes I know the Ratlines should go further up, really about getting the impression not faithful reproduction of any sailing/Skating vessel.
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/3ffbd8fp89vtfzk7y7trv/IceRigger_30.JPG?rlkey=atrptgwewwyhnmqo5861gcj8d&st=awxzsbff&raw=1)
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/c8etjqvf53yonuj7g6d2w/IceRigger_31.JPG?rlkey=9y2fwpyxbkr0yvxrosilxjynw&st=lzavgfjl&raw=1)
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/h5736sqarcw3ty1rlgqct/IceRigger_32.JPG?rlkey=02tsw22hqrikewy5rokabaqwg&st=74l3gnf3&raw=1)
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/9sdo58b8swyx723m5e4du/IceRigger_33.JPG?rlkey=bnilm1rejqa6obe9rmpg6xpwa&st=i6622tb4&raw=1)
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/m1u4eddtercg96j6flanr/IceRigger_34.JPG?rlkey=hee25dfmrtrsyg3f88qt163h2&st=kv59te67&raw=1)
(https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/ge212rtp1p5jm5sb71ft1/IceRigger_35.JPG?rlkey=e95pqxbg4n2ysag7nw2jhmxy9&st=glbqp9f7&raw=1)
The BFG is on a turntable and doctrinally should be operated as a broadside to clear sails and rigging. At this scale it is absurdly large calibre so not really feasible anyway.
Next project already on the bench and this is now awaiting the breakers yard ;) as I have no room in the cabinet.
Excellent concept & build, BT! :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Awesome build mate...that does look bang on :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
One thing I'm thinking about that rigging..on the open ocean the wind forces and the water would put a massive strain on the rigging..the weight of the water in the ropes would also be a huge amount of added weight...especially in rough water .
On ice .. different story...yep ya got the wind but that's about it ..ice will only form if there's water present ..not counting on that it'll never get wet but it won't be as often as at sea .
I'm thinking Buzzys rigging should work quite well for the job it's intended to do..yes it needs more detail but that would be nuts 😜 😉 ;)
Every one of us would rig this beauty differently.
I say, give the man a cigar.*
* but keep it away from the rigging! ;D
:thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Good job Buzzy. You should bring it to Ballarat.
That's just INCREDIBLE!
A superb job. :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
wonderful job
striking and elegant :thumbsup:
Wow, that's different & a very striking build! :thumbsup:
Beautiful job there - well done! :thumbsup:
Rodney Matthews is on Twitter ("X" :rolleyes: ) and there's a Michael Moorcock account too: do you mind if I post pics on there to show them?
(N)ice job!
Yeah yeah, hat-coat-door... :rolleyes:
Cool!
The sails look good, and the shape adds a point of difference from the RW.
:thumbsup: :thumbsup:
As to the rigging, back and forestays aren't necessary as the masts are obviously built up using a mix
of unobtanium alloys. This results in masts that are strong enough to accept the transfer of force from the
sails, but still flexible enough to absorb that force without bending to the point where they'd break.
;D
Quote from: Weaver on January 26, 2025, 05:38:47 PMBeautiful job there - well done! :thumbsup:
Rodney Matthews is on Twitter ("X" :rolleyes: ) and there's a Michael Moorcock account too: do you mind if I post pics on there to show them?
Humbled if you do.. Always been a big fan of Rodney Matthews and Michael Moorcock.
I have always considered posting on forums pretty much makes your images public domain anyway.
That looks just stunning :bow: