I've never heard of an XR8 before, but I like the idea, even if it is Ford. 

One thing about that Just Cars article though, he says that the car's owner '...has done away with the McPherson strut front suspension and fitted Bilstein Coil-overs....' If he had done that the wheels would fall off as there'd be nothing to locate the top of the front wheel uprights! 

Bilstein coil-overs would have just replaced the standard spring damper units of the original struts.

Quote from: PR19_Kit on May 24, 2023, 05:43:33 AMI've never heard of an XR8 before, but I like the idea, even if it is Ford. 

One thing about that Just Cars article though, he says that the car's owner '...has done away with the McPherson strut front suspension and fitted Bilstein Coil-overs....' If he had done that the wheels would fall off as there'd be nothing to locate the top of the front wheel uprights! 

Bilstein coil-overs would have just replaced the standard spring damper units of the original struts.

Kit mate you can get coil overs to replace McPherson struts which are direct bolt in replacements.
It's not like the old days when you had to rebuild the entire suspension system or at least redesign it.
Fact you can get em for Volvos 

Surely the replacements are still McPherson struts.  Just made by an aftermarket manufacturer rather than the OEM.

Quote from: zenrat on May 27, 2023, 04:03:28 AMSurely the replacements are still McPherson struts.  Just made by an aftermarket manufacturer rather than the OEM.

Exactly my point.

The upper strut location is the be-all and end-all of McPherson's design, it not only locates the upper point of the strut but is also the steering pivot, all in one piece. The coil-over just replaces the spring and damper part of it, the geometry of the strut doesn't change.

OK yeah technically it is a strut but it's also a non adjustable suspension unit.
A coilover unit not only gives you the ability to adjust height and tension of the spring for compression and rebound but also you can fit a adjustable top plate which will change the geometry of the strut.
Changing the struts geometry can change how the vehicle enters corners by changing the angle dictates how forces are transmitted from the road to the vehicle. 
I had to copy the last part as I couldn't think of how to describe it .

Well yes, but that's what suspension is all about anyway,  applying the cornering forces to the vehicle I mean.

The manufacturers don't make any of their standard systems adjustable in the first place because no-one would pay for it, and 90% of them wouldn't know what to do with the adjustments anyway. But just adding coil-overs doesn't change the original geometry, it'll change the amount of the force that gets transmitted and the severity with which it's transmitted.

Manufacturers would be wary of customers making their own adjustments, crashing, and then suing them.

Quote from: zenrat on May 28, 2023, 04:59:50 AMManufacturers would be wary of customers making their own adjustments, crashing, and then suing them.

Unfortunately, this is only too likely in most countries.  No matter what the problem "Somebody's got to be summonsed"  to quote the late Stanley Holloway.

Quote from: zenrat on May 28, 2023, 04:59:50 AMManufacturers would be wary of customers making their own adjustments, crashing, and then suing them.

I've got a very long and complex tale about a guy in the USA who tried to sue MG because he fell out of MGA once.

I can recount it if anyone's that interested.

Litigation is much more common in some countries than in UK.  An instance of this :-

A woman in USA successfully sued a fast food outlet because the take-out coffee she had bought had scalded her as she drove along holding it between her thighs.      An attempt was made to sue the same company  for the same reason  in the UK. The outcome was that the case failed, and the driver ended up being prosecuted for driving without due care and attention.

Fun fact!

A woman in Australia sued Macca's (McDonald's) for the same reason &, also, won.

About a year later another woman sued & won because her coffees were too cold, & she wasted too much of them as they became undrinkable before she finished them!

Why? Because Macca's had followed the directions of the first court & reduced the temperature of their coffees from the (recommended) 80^oC to the court ordered 60^oC, the second court ordering that the temperature of their coffees be raised to (Wait for it!) ... the recommended 80^oC!

As the second court was a higher court than the first, its ruling (still) stands.

Quote from: PR19_Kit on May 28, 2023, 08:40:08 AM

Quote from: zenrat on May 28, 2023, 04:59:50 AMManufacturers would be wary of customers making their own adjustments, crashing, and then suing them.

I've got a very long and complex tale about a guy in the USA who tried to sue MG because he fell out of MGA once.

I can recount it if anyone's that interested.

Yes please.

There was this cop in USA who sued Glock. He was installing something on the pistol, and at some point pulled the trigger while it was pointing at his leg or foot.... Bang! Ouch! If you have a loaded Glock, it is supposed to say Bang when you pull the trigger.

Quote from: zenrat on May 29, 2023, 03:34:22 AMYes please.

OK, seeing as you asked....................

Back in the mid 60s the US Safety Regulations fell upon the car manufacturing world and we in the UK all had to do all sorts of complicated tests to ensure the cars we exported to the US passed the regs. Because it was all VERY expensive building all these test rigs, all the UK manufacturers got together (an almost industry shattering event as they were all in competition with each other here of course!) and decided to portion out the work load. So Ford at Dunton in Essex tested everyone's collapsible steering columns, and we at Pressed Steel tested everyone's seat belt anchorages, at least for a while as the competition soon came back again.

The seat belt anchorage testing required a massive test rig with six long stroke hydraulic jacks and a complex control system, and as I was doing hydraulics at college I got the job of building the darn thing (thus standing me in good stead for my future career had I but known it....) and I became the 'Safety Tester' by reputation.

Fast forward a year or so until the US population discovered all sorts of good reasons to sue car manufacturers for NOT building cars to the regulations, and some guy in Indiana sued BMC because he'd fallen out of an MGA on a sharp corner because the door had opened and dumped him on the road. He figured that the car's door latches hadn't conformed to the Regulation because they weren't strong enough and therefore it was MGs, and BMC's fault, as MG was part of BMC.

Now the MGA had stopped being built in 1962, some three years BEFORE the Regulations came into force, but this didn't prevent the Judge, or District Attorney, or whoever putting forward the case and my boss, Bob Goff, was asked if we could test some MGA doors to see how strong, or weak they were, and as the 'Safety Tester' I got the job doing it. Luckily my then father-on-law was the Supervisor of the Spares Shop at Pressed Steel and I went and had a word and they dragged out the old press tools and punched out 50 sets of MGA doors to test. I rigged up a door test system and duly tested all 50 of them to ensure we got a good spread of results, and lo and behold, all 50 passed the 1965 Regulations with flying colours! 

Bob then had to fly over to Chicago for the trial, complete with an army of lawyers from both sides of the Atlantic, and armed with a vast file of my test results. (I did hold quite a campaign that I should go along with him to give personal evidence of the tests, but sadly I failed. ) The trial kicked off as expected, but failed at the first hurdle when the guy bringing the case showed up with pics and diagrams of the accident which showed he'd been a PASSENGER in the MGA, and being in America was on the right hand side of the car, and the car had been going round a RIGHT HAND bend when he fell out!!!!!!!

Apparently the Judge gave him an old fashioned look and threw the case out right away, so all my testing was in vain, but we would have won anyway. I never did find out if they'd awarded costs to BMC as all the charges for building 50 sets of doors and me building the rig and my and Bobs time etc. would have cost the guy a FORTUNE!

 

Which doors had you been testing?  Left or right?

I was once riding in a '35 Ford Phaeton.  It had no seat belts and the springs in the outside of the passenger side of the bench seat had collapsed so I slid to the outside and was leaning on the door.
This was quite comfortable right up to the point I realised that the only thing stopping me from falling out onto the road was a 75 (it was 2010) year old door latch...