Warning this is going to be a long (but hopefully interesting) post,

So I've always been fascinated by the idea of using WW2 era aircraft in the CAS/COIN role, especially in South-East Asia. The obvious poster kids for this were the AC-47 Spooky, the B/A-26 Invader and the slightly later Sandy. Now one of my favorite warbirds is the P-61 Black Widow, just something about it I always liked, even built a couple as a kid. I was watching HammerHead Models YouTube channel doing a build of the A-26K and about the same time had read somewhere that that the B-26 was considered as a potential night fighter, a role that the P-61 would win. So putting it all together I came up with what if you flipped the script so to speak and the P-61 could have been used like the B/A-26 through the 50's and 60's. So that's the next build. I'm starting with the HobbyBoss P-61C and then modifying it from there, similar to the A-26K.

Now here is the interesting part. I came up with a back-story about P-61s being acquired by the CIA and used in operations throughout the 50's up thru Vietnam. I threw in some technical details of the modifications and a bit about the clandestine nature of its missions. I'm not a great writer but I thought it wasn't too bad. I then decided to give it to Google's Gemini AI tool and asked it to rewrite it for an audience interested in aviation history (we've been playing around with different AI tools at work). What it came up with was really good, better than what I wrote. So I then worked with it some more going back and forth adding details but letting it dictate the tone. What finally came out, I think at least, is a pretty compelling alternative history. So here is the story the OA-61 Counter Widow (btw it helps if you read in the voice of the guy who does the Dark Skies channel on YouTube  )


Covert Wings: The OA-61F Counter Widow in Vietnam
The humid air hung heavy over the remote airstrip in Nakhon Phanom, Thailand. In the flickering pre-dawn light, a crew of American pilots, cloaked in an air of secrecy, performed final checks on a unique, twin-boomed aircraft. This wasn't your typical Cold War jet fighter; this was the OA-61F Counter Widow, a veteran of World War II, reborn for a clandestine war in the jungles of Southeast Asia. Its story, shrouded in secrecy, would become a testament to American ingenuity and the murky realities of the Cold War.

Origins: A Shadow Fleet Emerges
The year was 1964. The B-26 Invader, a workhorse of the CIA's clandestine operations in Southeast Asia, was grounded due to structural problems. A replacement was needed, and it arrived in the form of the unassuming OA-61F.
The OA-61F had a clandestine past, its lineage tracing back to the P-61 Black Widow, a World War II night fighter known for its versatility. The CIA, ever keen on plausible deniability, began quietly acquiring P-61s shortly after the war. These late-model airframes, some barely used, formed the foundation of a hidden fleet.

From Night Fighter to Shadow Warrior
The P-61's inherent flexibility made it perfect for the CIA's covert missions. Some P-61s were modified for dropping cargo or inserting operatives behind enemy lines, while others became reconnaissance platforms with cameras and electronic sensors replacing the night-fighting radar. The CIA, however, envisioned a more aggressive role for a select few.

Thus, the OA-61F Counter Widow was born. To transform the P-61 into a lethal ground attacker, the CIA oversaw a series of modifications. The wings were strengthened to handle a heavier payload, and additional hardpoints were added under each wing for mounting bombs and rockets and wingtip fuel tanks for additional range. The four 20mm cannons were replaced with more modern M39 cannons, offering greater firepower and more rounds per gun.

The radar operator's station, no longer needed, was removed to create space for additional ammunition. the gunner's compartment was transformed into a dedicated observer's position. This new role, replacing the traditional gunner entirely, offered a panoramic view and advanced communication equipment. The observer could now effectively coordinate with forces on the ground, help track targets and guide the pilot into optimal firing positions.

Crucially, the turret itself was retained, but its function was fundamentally altered. The pilot, not the observer, now controlled its traverse. By positioning the turret 90 degrees left or right, the pilot could unleash concentrated fire in a deadly ballet while circling overhead in a pylon turn – a tactic later employed by the AC-47 Spooky during the Vietnam War. Finally, additional firepower was crammed into the nose of the aircraft, replacing the radar entirely.

Operation Haik and the Bay of Pigs Fiasco: Unfulfilled Destinies

The OA-61Fs were initially slated for Operation Haik, a covert mission to support Indonesian rebels in the late 1950s.However, their deployment was delayed by conversion setbacks. By the time the modifications were complete, the CIA's sights had set on a closer target – providing air support for the Bay of Pigs invasion. With this new mission in mind, the aircraft were hurriedly flown to a remote corner of Eglin Air Force Base in Florida, where final upgrades were completed under a cloak of secrecy. There, hidden from view, they awaited their chance to strike.

However, the Bay of Pigs operation proved to be a volatile mix of political agendas and faulty planning. B-26s, deemed more familiar and easier to integrate, were chosen for the initial air attack. When the invasion unfolded in Cuba in 1961,the plan for the OA-61Fs shifted once again. They were envisioned as the core of a post-invasion Cuban air force. But the operation's disastrous failure shelved those plans entirely. The OA-61Fs, remained grounded in their secluded corner of Eglin AFB, a monument to the ever-shifting sands of covert operations and a stark reminder of the consequences of poorly planned interventions.

Rebirth in Vietnam: The Nimrods and Operation Farm Gate
The Bay of Pigs fallout kept the OA-61Fs out of sight for a time. Then came the Vietnam War. The B-26 grounding in 1964 presented a new opportunity. By summer's end, all 12 OA-61Fs were resurrected and deployed to Thailand under the cloak of the 609th Special Commando Squadron, also known as the Nimrods.

Officially tasked with training South Vietnamese Air Force (SVAF) personnel, the Nimrods were deeply entrenched in Operation Farm Gate, a covert CIA program supporting counterinsurgency operations in Laos. On October 11th, 1964, the OA-61Fs marked their deadly debut with airstrikes against Viet Cong targets in Laos, a baptism by fire that signaled a new chapter in the aircraft's clandestine career.

A Workhorse in the Shadows: Adaptability and Resilience
By 1966, the fleet had grown to 17 OA-61Fs, flying both overt and covert missions in support of operations in Vietnam and Laos. Their versatility and resilience made them invaluable assets, particularly for units like Military Assistance Command Studies and Observation Group (MACV-SOG) and the Air Force's 20th Special Operations Squadron, also known as the "Green Hornets."

Unlike the jet fighters of the era, the OA-61Fs could operate from remote, austere airfields with minimal support. Their crews, a mix of former military pilots and adventurous civilians, could perform repairs and modifications in the field,keeping them operational even in harsh conditions. This adaptability was crucial for MACV-SOG's clandestine missions deep behind enemy lines in Laos and Cambodia. The OA-61Fs, with their ability to deliver close air support and extract insertion/exfiltration teams, became a vital asset for these daring operations.

The Green Hornets, on the other hand, used the OA-61Fs for a different kind of unconventional warfare. These aircrews,known for their aggressive tactics and willingness to take risks, often flew night missions harassing communist supply lines and disrupting troop movements. The OA-61F's maneuverability and firepower, combined with the Green Hornet's pilots' daring, proved to be a potent combination in the night skies over Laos.

Often, these missions for both MACV-SOG and the Green Hornets necessitated an additional layer of deniability. The OA-61Fs were sometimes "loaned out" to shadowy contractors like Air America, who would then fly them with civilian markings. This further obscured CIA involvement in these sensitive operations.

As the war progressed, the reintroduction of the A-26 Invader provided a more conventional bombing platform. This allowed the OA-61Fs to focus even more on their clandestine specialty – operating under the radar in support of covert operations. The Widows, as they were nicknamed by their crews, continued to be a mainstay of the CIA's aerial arsenal in Southeast Asia, a potent symbol of American ingenuity and the murky realities of the Cold War.

A Deadly Clandestine Ballet: Living on the Razors Edge
A typical deployment to a remote airstrip in Laos underscored the covert nature of these operations. Under the cloak of darkness, a small but deadly force would assemble. Two OA-61F Counter Widows, their silhouettes menacing against the night sky, would be readied for action. Flanking them would be two or three UH-1 Huey helicopters, bristling with weaponry and manned by the Green Hornets – their reputation for aggressive tactics preceding them.

These helicopter gunships provided close air support and additional firepower during the mission. But the crews weren't the only passengers on these Hueys. Clad in black uniforms or nondescript civilian clothing, a contingent of MACV-SOG operatives or Montagnard commandos would be waiting, their faces obscured by shadows. These highly trained individuals were the tip of the spear, tasked with penetrating enemy lines and carrying out high-risk objectives.

The secrecy extended even further. On some occasions, "independent contractors" – a euphemism for mercenaries with no official ties to the US government – might be part of the contingent. These individuals, driven by a mix of ideology and profit, brought a particular set of skills to the table.

The entire operation was meticulously planned, a deadly ballet orchestrated under the veil of secrecy. With everything in place, the flickering flames of the airstrip would be extinguished, and the OA-61Fs and Huey gunships, shrouded in darkness, would lift off, rumbling towards their objective deep within Laos or Cambodia. The mission's success, and the very lives of the men on board, hinged on their ability to operate in the shadows, a testament to the lengths the US went to in its fight against communism during the Cold War.

These deployments to remote airstrips were typically short, lasting around 30 days. The austere conditions tested the limits of both men and machines. The crews endured the harsh realities of jungle life, with limited supplies, constant threat of enemy attacks, and the ever-present pressure of maintaining their flimsy cover. Mechanics performed maintenance under makeshift shelters, while pilots grappled with the challenge of navigating over dense jungle canopy and unfamiliar terrain at night.

For the operatives on board, the 30 days were a blur of high-stakes missions, relying on their skills and the firepower of the OA-61Fs and Green Hornet gunships for survival. The specter of capture loomed large, as there would be no official recognition from the US government if anything went wrong.

Despite the hardships, these deployments delivered critical intelligence and disrupted enemy operations. The OA-61Fs and the men who flew them became a symbol of American ingenuity and the murky realities of the Cold War fought in the shadows.

Covert Wings: The OA-61F Counter Widow in Vietnam (Conclusion)
The OA-61F's legacy in Vietnam is shrouded in secrecy. By 1969, as the American presence in Southeast Asia began to wane, the curtain finally closed on the program. Only 10 OA-61Fs remained, the rest lost to accidents, enemy fire, or the harsh realities of operating in an unforgiving environment. These survivors were officially handed over to the struggling South Vietnamese Air Force, though documented evidence of their service with the SVAF is scarce.

The OA-61F's story is a fascinating glimpse into the shadowy world of Cold War airpower. The OA-61F carved a unique niche in Vietnam. This repurposed World War II aircraft, flown by a mix of skilled pilots, became a vital tool for covert operations conducted by a clientele pushing the boundaries of international law. The OA-61F served in the twilight, a testament to American ingenuity and the lengths to which nations would go to pursue their agendas in the shadows. Their impact on the Vietnam War may be difficult to quantify, but their presence serves as a reminder of the hidden threads that weave through the fabric of historical conflicts.

I'm very interested in this concept. I have a 1/48th P-61 Monogram kit on the shelf and I've been considering this idea for some time. This will be cool!

There is a widow hidden in all these boxes here ... 

That's an interesting, and very believable read 

I've often wondered why the "Black Widow" wasn't used in this role. I suppose it was down to availability or lack of it.

By the way do I now have to enroll "Gemini AI" as a member ?   

Quote from: NARSES2 on June 16, 2024, 12:44:01 AMI've often wondered why the "Black Widow" wasn't used in this role. I suppose it was down to availability or lack of it.

A good chunk of them were scrapped after the war.  Their apparent use "no longer necessary".   

Some were used as strike aircraft towards the end of the war strafing trains and such.

Quote from: scooter on June 16, 2024, 05:50:23 AM

Quote from: NARSES2 on June 16, 2024, 12:44:01 AMI've often wondered why the "Black Widow" wasn't used in this role. I suppose it was down to availability or lack of it.

A good chunk of them were scrapped after the war.  Their apparent use "no longer necessary".   

I read that some of the last ones never left Hawthorne factory. There was an attempt to convert some to a long range bomber escort right after the war but the F-82 ended up with that job instead.

Quote from: NARSES2 on June 16, 2024, 12:44:01 AMThat's an interesting, and very believable read 

I've often wondered why the "Black Widow" wasn't used in this role. I suppose it was down to availability or lack of it.

By the way do I now have to enroll "Gemini AI" as a member ?   

It's been a really interesting little experiment. I would ask it if the OA-61 would have been useful for MACV-SOG units and it would explain how and then write that into the storyline. I never mentioned Cambodia but it wrote it in as there were covert operations by the units I mentioned going on there. I wrote about using the pylon turn tactic and it added in the part about the AC-47 using that same tactic. As I looked at the modification options I'd ask the AI questions like "could a M134 fit in the nose in place of the radar" and it would come back with the size and weight and figure out if there was room and some of the pros and cons. Overall it's kinda fun, kinda cool, and kinda creepy 

BTW I did another AI generated storyline over in the Idea Bank https://www.whatifmodellers.com/index.php?topic=52956.0

The biggest logistical problem with the P-61 was relatively low production of multiple variants, 13
of the P-61 plus the F-15. The variant with the largest production was the P-61B-15 and that was
only 153 aircraft. The Air Force considered it an orphan type and too expensive to support.  Also it
actually wasn't a very good aircraft and it had a lot of problems during its service, so the Air Force
had no problem showing it the door. 

36 of the F-15A Reporter were constructed, this was an adaptation of the XP-61E fighter concept.
It used the same turbosupercharged R-2800-73 engines as the P-61C and it saw limited and very
problematic service as it was a maintenance nightmare. 

Sixteen P-61B were converted for meteorological research under the designation P-61G - which
could make a good cover story.

Quote from: jcf on June 16, 2024, 04:23:06 PMThe biggest logistical problem with the P-61 was relatively low production of multiple variants, 13
of the P-61 plus the F-15. The variant with the largest production was the P-61B-15 and that was
only 153 aircraft. The Air Force considered it an orphan type and too expensive to support.  Also it
actually wasn't a very good aircraft and it had a lot of problems during its service, so the Air Force
had no problem showing it the door.

36 of the F-15A Reporter were constructed, this was an adaptation of the XP-61E fighter concept.
It used the same turbosupercharged R-2800-73 engines as the P-61C and it saw limited and very
problematic service as it was a maintenance nightmare.

Sixteen P-61B were converted for meteorological research under the designation P-61G - which
could make a good cover story.

That made me think of the F-111. There might have been greater numbers of F-111s but it was split up into several subtypes to the point of being almost completely different aircraft on the inside. That always leads to maintenance and logistics nightmares. The USAF dumped them right after the Gulf War and the break up of the Soviet Union when supposedly the Cold War was over and we didn't need them anymore. My uncle worked depot level maintenance on F-111 and said they were always a problem. Some were not even manufactured correctly.

Quote from: HarryPhishnuts on June 16, 2024, 11:02:16 AMOverall it's kinda fun, kinda cool, and kinda creepy 

Tell me about it, I had something a tad "scarry" happen with AI over the weekend. I was happy with the end product, but nonetheless it made me think "where the hell will this thing end up ?"

Forgot to mention I"m also going to use this project to try out MIG's new ATOM paints for the SEA camo. Been pretty much a Vallejo guy so far so curious to see how these work out.

I have a vague memory of being told of a proposed recce version with cameras replacing the cannons, and the radar operators' position deleted in favour of fuel tankage. Don't know if the turret was retained, I suspect not.

https://www.whatifmodellers.com/index.php?topic=51733.0

Quote from: Geoff on June 17, 2024, 08:56:18 AMI have a vague memory of being told of a proposed recce version with cameras replacing the cannons, and the radar operators' position deleted in favour of fuel tankage.
Don't know if the turret was retained, I suspect not.

Wasn't the F-15 the recce version of the P-61?