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What If R.G. LeTourneau had the German KRUPP RAUMER S?

Started by seadude, December 13, 2024, 06:30:45 PM

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seadude

What will I do with a TAKOM 1/35 scale Krupp Raumer S model kit?
Or perhaps a better question is: What did R.G. LeTourneau do with the real Krupp Raumer after WWII?
But first, a bit of real history on the Krupp Raumer S. The below text is from the Wikipedia article on the vehicle before the Wikipedia article got deleted long ago.

QuoteThe Raumer S (Selbstrantrieb) was a heavily armoured minesweeper developed and built by Krupp for Germany during the Second World War. Weighing over 130 tons, this behemoth was effectively two sections articulated in the center, and moved by massive steel wheels that were 2.7 meters in diameter. The vehicle was 15 meters long and 4 meters high. The track widths differed between the front and rear to encourage a wider sweep path. Each section of the Raumer S was powered by a Mayback HL90 engine generating 360 hp and 3600 rpm. The Raumer S could also be driven from either section. Although armaments were not placed on the prototype which was created, there were plans to mount 7.92mm MG-42 machine guns for both anti-personnel and anti-aircraft roles. At the end of the war the sole existing Raumer S prototype was captured by the US Military in Hillersleben 1945. After capture, it was divided into two parts and moved to a U.S. Depot near Paris. Any further information about the remains of the Raumer S is unknown.

Unknown...........until now.  ;)
So who is R.G. LeTourneau and what is he famous for? Him and the company he created were famous for creating what were called "overland trains".
More information at the following links:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overland_train
https://overlandtrains.com/
What would happen if LeTourneau had gotten his hands on the Krupp Raumer S? What would he do with it? Maybe use it for testing and evaluation purposes in preparation for developing his other overland train concepts? Could be. ;)  I wouldn't be surprised if there was a tiny hint of truth to that. Or maybe LeTourneau also took inspiration from the large Antarctic Snow Cruiser vehicle that was built in the late 1930's too.
Whatever the case, I'm going to build the Krupp Raumer S model as if LeTourneau had gotten a hold of it and used it for testing purposes before he created his other overland train vehicles. It'll be painted in the same bright red/orange color as his other overland train vehicles. And I'll replace the Krupp Raumer's wheels with new rubber wheels/tires. Possibly have to use maybe large tires from radio controlled cars/trucks.





And here's some pics of the real German Krupp Raumer S vehicle from World War II.

















Modeling isn't just about how good the gluing or painting, etc. looks. It's also about how creative and imaginative you can be with a subject.
My modeling philosophy is: Don't build what everyone else has done. Build instead what nobody has seen or done before.

seadude

Modeling isn't just about how good the gluing or painting, etc. looks. It's also about how creative and imaginative you can be with a subject.
My modeling philosophy is: Don't build what everyone else has done. Build instead what nobody has seen or done before.

kerick

I hope that poor driver of that thing had lots of armor in the floor of that cab! What a monster!
This will be quite the build to watch.
" Somewhere, between half true, and completely crazy, is a rainbow of nice colours "
Tophe the Wise

Wardukw

Yep I'm agreeing with Ken ...this us going to be a cool build 😎 🤗
If it aint broke ,,fix it until it is .
Over kill is often very understated .
I know the voices in my head ain't real but they do come up with some great ideas.
Theres few of lifes problems that can't be solved with the proper application of a high explosive projectile .

seadude

Quote from: kerick on December 13, 2024, 09:52:36 PMI hope that poor driver of that thing had lots of armor in the floor of that cab! What a monster!
This will be quite the build to watch.

Oh, I'm pretty sure the Raumer was heavily armored, especially the crew cab area. After all, this thing was designed as a minesweeper. And some mines could be pretty powerful.
Modeling isn't just about how good the gluing or painting, etc. looks. It's also about how creative and imaginative you can be with a subject.
My modeling philosophy is: Don't build what everyone else has done. Build instead what nobody has seen or done before.


Wardukw

The armour on this beast was very thick ..with its solid wheels and a weight in the 130ton area this thing would have done thru mine fields with ease ...but just wait till it hit a field with nice wet soft mud..then it's bugga time .
If it aint broke ,,fix it until it is .
Over kill is often very understated .
I know the voices in my head ain't real but they do come up with some great ideas.
Theres few of lifes problems that can't be solved with the proper application of a high explosive projectile .

seadude

Quote from: Wardukw on December 14, 2024, 04:48:43 PMThe armour on this beast was very thick ..with its solid wheels and a weight in the 130ton area this thing would have done thru mine fields with ease ...but just wait till it hit a field with nice wet soft mud..then it's bugga time .

And that's one of the things I need to change on this kit. If LeTourneau had gotten a hold of this vehicle and wanted to test it out in preparation for developing his overland train type vehicles, he more than likely would have replaced the steel wheels on the Krupp Raumer with regular large rubber tires so as to test and evaluate how well such a large vehicle could travel over rough terrain like desert, hills, snow, forests, and such. That's the types of terrain LeTourneau's overland trains were expected to traverse.
Most of the tires/wheels on LeTourneau's overland trains were approximately 10 feet in diameter and 4 feet wide. In 1/35 scale, that approximates to about a little more than 3" inches in diameter and a little over 1" inch wide. Now the only tires I'll be able to find in that range are for radio control toy vehicles, but preferably of the construction type. I'd love to match the exact tread pattern of the tires that LeTourneau had (Picture below) on his overland trains, but I've had no such luck.
Another thing I need to change/add to the vehicle are hand holds and foot ladders for the crew to get into the cabs. Thankfully, I've got some spare sprue and other model parts that will be good for that.
As for painting the Krupp Raumer, LeTourneau's overland trains seem to be in a red/orange type of color. I'm going to paint my model the same way. I'll be using Vallejo # 71.086 Light Red. It's not completely red nor is it completely orange.
As for other additions and deletions to the vehicle, I don't know yet.
Modeling isn't just about how good the gluing or painting, etc. looks. It's also about how creative and imaginative you can be with a subject.
My modeling philosophy is: Don't build what everyone else has done. Build instead what nobody has seen or done before.

Wardukw

There was another mine clearing vehicle that was on the wiffy boards in ww2 Germany...this thing looks abit like the Raumer...the difference was the wheels..bloody huge steel wheels with steel tractor treads.
That thing would do pretty good offroad as long as the ground isn't too soft .
Those tyres and wheels are a problem for you for sure ...RC car rims for 1/10th scale are 2" to 2"2 in diameter with the width being like 1.5" .
The tread is the issue as you've coming across...even sand treads wouldn't be that useful ..just to damn big .
One idea might be a mini block tread or micro pin type ...the shape is going to stop ya dead I'm afraid..I used to race RC cars and there's no tyres I know of with that shape ...as you've seen ..there all pretty much square sided ..not rounded ..the only ones I know that are definitely like that are the ones we raced on our trucks but those are far to big .
Ohh ..just had a thought....check out Tamiyas range of wheels and tyres ..they have so many different RC cars and trucks and a large variety of tyres and wheels .
If it aint broke ,,fix it until it is .
Over kill is often very understated .
I know the voices in my head ain't real but they do come up with some great ideas.
Theres few of lifes problems that can't be solved with the proper application of a high explosive projectile .

seadude

Quote from: Wardukw on December 14, 2024, 06:19:57 PMThere was another mine clearing vehicle that was on the wiffy boards in ww2 Germany...this thing looks abit like the Raumer...the difference was the wheels..bloody huge steel wheels with steel tractor treads.
That thing would do pretty good offroad as long as the ground isn't too soft .
Those tyres and wheels are a problem for you for sure ...RC car rims for 1/10th scale are 2" to 2"2 in diameter with the width being like 1.5" .
The tread is the issue as you've coming across...even sand treads wouldn't be that useful ..just to damn big .
One idea might be a mini block tread or micro pin type ...the shape is going to stop ya dead I'm afraid..I used to race RC cars and there's no tyres I know of with that shape ...as you've seen ..there all pretty much square sided ..not rounded ..the only ones I know that are definitely like that are the ones we raced on our trucks but those are far to big .
Ohh ..just had a thought....check out Tamiyas range of wheels and tyres ..they have so many different RC cars and trucks and a large variety of tyres and wheels .

The only items that had the tread I am thinking about and what is shown in the pic I provided were to the best of my knowledge some toy tractors that I saw or had ages ago when I was a kid. I know I've seen that tread pattern before, but it may have been back in the 70's or 80's on various toys. There's an antique shop in my area that deals in toys and other stuff. I may have to go there sometime.
As for that other German mine clearing vehicle you were thinking about, was it this one as pictured below?
Modeling isn't just about how good the gluing or painting, etc. looks. It's also about how creative and imaginative you can be with a subject.
My modeling philosophy is: Don't build what everyone else has done. Build instead what nobody has seen or done before.

kerick

Some stores have different toy trucks on sale with various sized tires and wheels. It doesn't have to be perfect, just believable.
" Somewhere, between half true, and completely crazy, is a rainbow of nice colours "
Tophe the Wise

Wardukw

The Alkett ain't the bugger I saw ..the one I'm remembering was articulated like yours but with much wider wheels and one thing I just remembered the wheels are also smaller in diameter too.
This machine sat lower to the ground than yours ...im going to have to go thru alot of pics and magazines to find this thing  :banghead:  ;D
If it aint broke ,,fix it until it is .
Over kill is often very understated .
I know the voices in my head ain't real but they do come up with some great ideas.
Theres few of lifes problems that can't be solved with the proper application of a high explosive projectile .

NARSES2

The thing I don't understand with that type of vehichle is that while it may well explode the mines it actually drives over there will still be an "unswept" area between the wheels ? Or did they simply assume that the blast from a detonated mine would explode those "unswept" ? I'm not sure it would.
Do not condemn the judgement of another because it differs from your own. You may both be wrong.

Wardukw

Quote from: NARSES2 on December 15, 2024, 12:41:03 AMThe thing I don't understand with that type of vehichle is that while it may well explode the mines it actually drives over there will still be an "unswept" area between the wheels ? Or did they simply assume that the blast from a detonated mine would explode those "unswept" ? I'm not sure it would.
The way they were ment to work was to drive over an area multiple times to clear a path but also to used to make a single path for tanks for rapid movement.
The vehicles weight was used to crush anti tank and anti personal mines ...also to handle the blast from double and triple stacked mines .
Destroying multi mines from one detonation was unlikely because they were layed out in specific pattens like a zig zag layout and at a distance which would cause multiple mines to explode.
A nasty trick for the sappers..they'd stack a AT mines on top of another..when you'd lift the top one the one below detonates ..a medium tank like a Sherman could end up it's side from a blast the big ..I have seen Sherman's on their turret roofs cause of that sort of blast .
If it aint broke ,,fix it until it is .
Over kill is often very understated .
I know the voices in my head ain't real but they do come up with some great ideas.
Theres few of lifes problems that can't be solved with the proper application of a high explosive projectile .

seadude

Quote from: kerick on December 14, 2024, 09:58:11 PMSome stores have different toy trucks on sale with various sized tires and wheels. It doesn't have to be perfect, just believable.

Actually, the size of the tires/wheels that I'll need does need to be perfect. Anything bigger than 3" inches in diameter and the tires won't turn. They'll just rub up against the hull chassis.

Quote from: Wardukw on December 15, 2024, 01:27:20 AM
Quote from: NARSES2 on December 15, 2024, 12:41:03 AMThe thing I don't understand with that type of vehichle is that while it may well explode the mines it actually drives over there will still be an "unswept" area between the wheels ? Or did they simply assume that the blast from a detonated mine would explode those "unswept" ? I'm not sure it would.
The way they were ment to work was to drive over an area multiple times to clear a path but also to used to make a single path for tanks for rapid movement.
The vehicles weight was used to crush anti tank and anti personal mines ...also to handle the blast from double and triple stacked mines .
Destroying multi mines from one detonation was unlikely because they were layed out in specific pattens like a zig zag layout and at a distance which would cause multiple mines to explode.
A nasty trick for the sappers..they'd stack a AT mines on top of another..when you'd lift the top one the one below detonates ..a medium tank like a Sherman could end up it's side from a blast the big ..I have seen Sherman's on their turret roofs cause of that sort of blast .

I did see/find this pic (Below) on the Net. Would the Raumer have had something like that on the front for mine clearing? Could it have worked? Not sure if that attachment was a real thing or something from somebody's imagination.
Modeling isn't just about how good the gluing or painting, etc. looks. It's also about how creative and imaginative you can be with a subject.
My modeling philosophy is: Don't build what everyone else has done. Build instead what nobody has seen or done before.