Designations?

[P1127]

OK, we know that no names were assigned to the TSR2 or the F111k (or were they? ) but was there any suggestion as to the designation to be assigned? I know these are usually confirmed at CoA Release, but there must have been something? (That said, would you have expected T1 and F2 for the Typhoon?)

TSR2mk1 (a) doesn't sound right and (B) is so outside the RAF designation system as to not count - S for Strike was strictly Naval. So would it have been GRmk1 or B® mk 1

Same for F-111K - GR or B?

[TsrJoe]

F.111K was to be Mk.1 and Mk.2...according to the files there were three names suggested, all surprisingly 'v' ones too

the TSR.2 files dont seem to show any designator for the type altho it was to have been listed as a bomber within bomber/strike command...iv finally found its name tho...(and it wasnt f... Trenchard!)

cheers, joe    

[Geoff_B]

the TSR.2 files dont seem to show any designator for the type altho it was to have been listed as a bomber within bomber/strike command...iv finally found its name tho...(and it wasnt f... Trenchard!)

Didn't bombers tend to have placenames ?

[TsrJoe]

chuckle...you guys know fine well...

...ah well here goes...to the  chaps at English Electric, the P.17 was to be the 'Thunder' but as that was an EE. suggestion the chaps at Vickers didnt like that one bit for the joint EE.P.17/VS.571 hybrid which became TSR.2!

a short time later not so very far away in a big country mansion set in the countryside, some officers at the Staff Training College at Bracknell put forward a suggestion based upon the well known cap badge symbol of HM.s RAF. (and no its not the 'sh..hawk'!) ... the 'Eagle'

and the rest as they say is history...Panavia 200 Panther, MRCA. Tornado, EFA. Tempest/Typhoon, etc...

cheers, joe  

[Captain Canada]

CF-102

CF-112

Either will do for me !

 

[P1127]

Velvet Eagle GR1 ??

[Nick]

Velvet Eagle sounds like a 70's rock group with a dodgy rep for drugs!
What were the 'V' names suggested for the F-111K?

Nick B)  

[lancer]

What were the 'V' names suggested for the F-111K?

Try Vulnerable; Vanquished; Vain...    

a short time later not so very far away in a big country mansion set in the countryside, some officers at the Staff Training College at Bracknell put forward a suggestion based upon the well known cap badge symbol of HM.s RAF. (and no its not the 's...hawk'!) ... the 'Eagle'

The RAF Staff College is no more than 2 mile from where I live. All closed down now, and the Hunter gate guardian is long gone *sob - would've looked nice parked on the green in my block*. Guess what the wonderful MoD is doing with the land??? selling it for bloody HOUSING!!!!!! Typical, like we need more houses in the town!! Should have left it with a military function.

Of course, I'm not pissed at the MoD, no not at all.......    

[joesus]

I'm not too sure about this F-111K designation. That seems to imply that K was reserved for British purchases by the governments on both sides of the Atlantic, but wasn't F-4K just the next letter on after the USN F-4J? I don't think they'd got to J even, on the 111, and the "H" was assigned to a much improved re-engined model in the 70s. Seems like a mid 60s British buy would have pre-empted an earlier letter. And is it F-4K really what the RAF calls it, or is it more properly the Phantom FGR?  

[uk 75]

I have found this post interesting and am still a little confused, as I have not got around to looking at documents at the PRO (or Papers R us or whatever it calls itself now).  Can anyone help me with the following questions:

1.   How many squadrons (numbers if known) were down to have TSR2s in the UK, Germany and elsewhere (Cyprus or Far East).
2.   How many were going to have the specialised PR role as opposed to strike role.
3.   Although Jaguar and Tornado used the GR1/GR1A designation, I wonder whether the TSR, or at least SR might have stuck?
4.   I am fascinated by the idea that TSR2 and F111K were down to have "V" names.  TSR2 was sold as a Canberra rather than Vulcan replacement. However, by 1965 NATO SACEUR had lost its dedicated theatre strike force of Valiants from the UK.  This might have been a way of saving the TSR2 and later F111K had the issue of Russian theatre missiles not been calmed by the introduction of Polaris (it later re-emerged in the 70s).  Love to know that the F111 names were?  Ian Fleming calls his V plane in "Thunderball" the "Vindicator"!

[Martin H]

I'm not too sure about this F-111K designation. That seems to imply that K was reserved for British purchases by the governments on both sides of the Atlantic, but wasn't F-4K just the next letter on after the USN F-4J? I don't think they'd got to J even, on the 111, and the "H" was assigned to a much improved re-engined model in the 70s. Seems like a mid 60s British buy would have pre-empted an earlier letter. And is it F-4K really what the RAF calls it, or is it more properly the Phantom FGR?

If I remember correctly the K was issued by the US DOD for those aircraft types sold to us Brits. F-4K, F-111K and C-130K. Purly a book keeping thing I think, as we never used em (offically)  

[TsrJoe]

re. the names for the F.111K Mk.1 & Mk.2 according to an as yet unverified reference the suggestions were...Valhalla, Vindicator (interesting re the mention of Flemings' Thunderball novel!) and the proposed favourite...'Vengeance'

hope this helps,

cheers, Joe    

(hmmm...i wonder what the 'AFVG' was to have been called...'Mirage G8'   )

ps. having said that i suppose 'Panther' may have been the most likely as 'AFVG' was the adjunct project with the 'Jaguar' and later, the Panavia consortium did suggest it originally for what became 'Tornado'

[Geoff_B]

(hmmm...i wonder what the 'AFVG' was to have been called...'Mirage G8'  )

ps. having said that i suppose 'Panther' may have been the most likely as 'AFVG' was the adjunct project with the 'Jaguar' and later, the Panavia consortium did suggest it originally for what became 'Tornado'

Well that Panther in the Airfix Hawk 100 will come in nicely, so who's doing the AFVG then ?

Thor  B)  

[elmayerle]

re. the names for the F.111K Mk.1 & Mk.2 according to an as yet unverified reference the suggestions were...Valhalla, Vindicator (interesting re the mention of Flemings' Thunderball novel!) and the proposed favourite...'Vengeance'

hope this helps,

cheers, Joe    

(hmmm...i wonder what the 'AFVG' was to have been called...'Mirage G8'   )

ps. having said that i suppose 'Panther' may have been the most likely as 'AFVG' was the adjunct project with the 'Jaguar' and later, the Panavia consortium did suggest it originally for what became 'Tornado'

Given that the old A_35 "Vengeance" was manufactured by a predecessor company to GD, "Vengeance" sounds like a quite appropriate name for the F-111K.

[iceman65]

Hi Guys,

As a thought regarding all of this, in my alternate RAF, the F-111K is called the Vigilant GR.1.  Previous mentions regarding the K designator are quite correct, the US reserving these for UK based exports.

Regards