Missiles not usually seen on aircraft types ...

[Weaver]

Oman is RAFO: Royal Air Force of Oman

ORAF: Old Rhodesian Air Force
http://www.ourstory.com/orafs

Hunter with sidewinder thread, origin of the photos copied over on the Key forum:
http://www.ourstory.com/thread.html?t=305460#330100

Thank Jon, for the acronym correction.  I was right that it gained the SAAF marking during trials, it seems.  Interesting that the Hunter was better than the Mirage III in a dogfight.  Obviously the delta planform bled too much energy in a turning fight.

IIRC, in 1973 an Israeli Mirage chased a Jordanian Hunter (flown by a highly experienced squadron commander) all  over the Golan Heights for eight minutes before getting him, and then only because he made a mistake.

[rickshaw]

That's how they usually do get got. 

The victor in battle is usually the one who makes the least number of mistakes.

[Weaver]

That's how they usually do get got. 

The victor in battle is usually the one who makes the least number of mistakes.

Or the one who was never seen by the victim in the first place. I recall reading that an analysis of air combat reports showed that something like 75% of victims were unaware of the existance or position of the opposing aircraft until the rounds started hitting. Certainly many of the aces had this "stalking" approach: most of Von Richtofen's kills were against artillery spotting planes which he got by sneaking up on in their blind spot and then blasting them at point blank range without warning. Nothing wrong with that of course (in fact a hatred of arty spotters was what prompted Von R to transfer to air in the first place), but it's not quite the "noble dualling knights of the air" image that Hollywood would like to sell you...

[rickshaw]

That's how they usually do get got.  

The victor in battle is usually the one who makes the least number of mistakes.

Or the one who was never seen by the victim in the first place. I recall reading that an analysis of air combat reports showed that something like 75% of victims were unaware of the existance or position of the opposing aircraft until the rounds started hitting. Certainly many of the aces had this "stalking" approach: most of Von Richtofen's kills were against artillery spotting planes which he got by sneaking up on in their blind spot and then blasting them at point blank range without warning. Nothing wrong with that of course (in fact a hatred of arty spotters was what prompted Von R to transfer to air in the first place), but it's not quite the "noble dualling knights of the air" image that Hollywood would like to sell you...

Are you suggesting, sir, that I believe anything Hollywood tells me?

The whole "knights of the air" rubbish grew up out of comparing air combat to the mud and blood of the Western Front by journalists who were looking for some glamour amongst the horrors of industrialised warfare.   Its really romanticised claptrap.  Remember, no 'chutes and if your plane was hit it was a choice of either jumping or burning.  It was also just as brutal and startlingly quick.

In the AWM in Canberra that's brought home with the short movie Peter Jackson did for them on air fighting over the Western Front.   With his special effects magic, you're brought right into the middle of the dogfight and what was really surprising was just how quick it all was, with planes whizzing around about and people getting killed and their planes burning every few seconds.   He based the film on the reports of one particular late war dogfight between the RFC and the Germans.   Really well done.   Well worth seeing.

You're right, most victims in air combat never even saw their opponents.  They'd be in an advantageous position and a few squirts with their guns and down you'd go!  "Beware the Hun in the Sun!"  Wasn't coined for nothing.

[jcf]

A private web page isn't necessarily the definition taken as 'normal' by any stretch.  The Rhodesian Air Force had quite a few acronyms during its existance and ORAF 'Old Rhodesian Air Force' wasn't one of them.  This is merely a title for a website, not anything official which can be equally misleading.

Regards,

Mav

No one said it was official, if you look closely at the photos you'll see in the upper left corner ORAFs: T. Megentale.
Which means Old Rhodesian Air Force Sods, photos from Tino Megentale.

[Weaver]

Are you suggesting, sir, that I believe anything Hollywood tells me?

Certainly not ,Sir, I'm suggesting that that is what Hollywood would like you to believe. The extent to which you care about what Hollywood would like is, of course, entirely up to you.