Carrier compatability......

[Army of One]

Dear all.......just wondering (as its gonna happen anyway...... ).....but could an F14D take off from a ski jump equipped carrier like.....say.....maybe a Kuznetsov class.....? I have read that a Su33 max take off weight is just under 73,000lbs.....the F14D is just over 74,000lbs.....the Su33 has 27,700lbs thrust from each engine and the F14D 27,8000lbs of thrust from each in reheat......so on paper it seems ok.....I'm sure there are some other factors that come in to play.......anyone got any ideas.....? Maybe the F14D take with less fuel and top up after......any ideas/discussion welcome.....

[darthspud]

Guess it would depend if there was a catapult fitted into the ski ramp. From memory the US Navy used flat decks and never used ramps, USMC may have done, not sure.

[Army of One]

I am aware that the USN haven't used a ski jump for their carriers......my question is could an F14D use one.......in theory....

[lenny100]

i believe the us navy did some study's  in the 1980s with the f 18a and a-6  and they found it was cabable of using a ski jump and enabled greater launch loads, but the deck space required for the cat and ramp was greater than a none ski jump launch so they stoped the study, never said anything about the f 14 but i think they were looking at the smaller carriers like midway

[Weaver]

Just about any aircraft with good low-speed characteristics (all CTOL carrier ones, by definition) and a decent thrust-to-weight ratio can use a ski jump, but the question is, can they do it at a useful weight? IIRC, the ski-jump MTO weight for an Su-33 is much less than the runway MTO weight.

[Army of One]

Cheers H.......I took my info for the Su33 from The Illustrated Encyclopaedia of Aircraft Carriers and Naval Aircraft by Bernard Ireland and Francis Crosby......

[Spey_Phantom]

there were test back in the early 80's 
aircraft tested were the S-2 Tracker, E-2 Hawkeye, F-18, A-6,...
ive seen a video of it somewhere, but i cant find it 

[Captain Canada]

In the whif world the answer is, of course, "of course ! "



But judging by the weights and power that you have listed, I don't see why not. Might have to do somat with the oleos tho, maybe stiffen them up so you don't crack the ventral fins off....

[Army of One]

Nils.......thanks very much.....
Cap'n C........just the answer I was looking for........ many thanks.............

[sandiego89]

As weaver states, usefull load is a factor that needs to be looked at.  IIRC few (none?) of the soviet/russian aircraft like mig-29s and Su-27/33 using ski jumps do so at max take of weight. Most photos show very few external store when using the ramp, but of course they show them chock full of stores when parked at the trade show/airshow.

So perhaps an F-14 with a few sidewinders and sparows might be realistic.  A full up f-14 with 6  phoenix, winders , sparrows and two tanks may be less realistic. I agree that an F-14 would be similair to the Su on a Kusteov size carrier. A carrier smaller than that would be problematic.   

Actually the ski-jump is the easier part, recovery may be your lmiting factor. The size, weight and speed of the aircraft may be too much for the ship and arresting gear.  Larger aircraft like the f-111b, S-3, E-2 and the f-14 were deemed not suitable for "small" carriers like the Essex and Midway classes. Even the f-4 was to much for these carriers. The Ark Royal was less than optimal for the UK spey powered version of the f-4.  The landing area of the Charles de Gaulle had to be extended to safely operate the heavy and large E-2.  Massive amount of energy to be absorbed by the carrier and the arresting gear.

So to keep it realistic, you need a good sized carrier for an F-14, with adequate size for the run up and ski jump, and plenty of length on the angeled dack and good recovery gear.  Likely a kustenov size is the smallest that you could realistically operate an STOBAR F-14 from.  An f-14 on small ski ramp carrier like a Hermes or Vikrant is not realistic.   

[Army of One]

A very informative reply........many thanks....under certain circumstances maybe a reasonably loaded F14D with loads less fuel and tank after take off maybe........

[zenrat]

I'd like to supplement the good Captains answer with the following.

RATO packs.