Western Flankers

[B777LR]

Chavez has said he would buy military aircraft from Russia or China after accusing the U.S. of snubbing him, and has threatened to hand over F-16 technology to Cuba.

Shall the US give him a few JDAMs and LGBs? What about some cruise missiles? All of that for free, All of that delivered the fastest. All of that delivered by the US navy!      
 

[PolluxDeltaSeven]

Really? yes, thats a pitty. The flanker was the favourite. But now We will have the second-hand Mirage 2000 sad.gif

But, here is the place for dreaming...

The Flanker was the favourite for the FAB or for the industrials??
As far as I know, Dassault had a very good proposal too. Of course, the Mirage 2000BR (an advanced Mirage 2000-5 variant) didn't have the Su-35's range, but with a Mirage production line to be open in Brazil and the authorisation to sell and build every Mirage 2000 produce for American continent, it was quite interresting for Brazilian government...
But well, I supposed that Sukhoï did some propositions too and, as usual, the debate was between an efficient expensive western fighter (but cheap to maintain) and a cheap excellent russian fighter (but quite a nightmare to maintain!!)...
Economical and political choice, after all...

But whatever was the winner, it could have been cool to see a new fighter in Brazilian markings...
Now, even if the Mirage 2000C are not totally bullsh!t, they are from the first batch (in capacities, they are close to the F-16 Block 25) and clearly far far from what the FAB deserve!!

But well, maybe a new competition between Rafale and Su-35 in the next years?

[Shasper]

Shall the US give him a few JDAMs and LGBs? What about some cruise missiles? All of that for free, All of that delivered the fastest. All of that delivered by the US navy!

*insert banned comment*

Watch you airspeed


Shas B)

[Rogerolim]

The Flanker was the favourite for the FAB or for the industrials??
As far as I know, Dassault had a very good proposal too. Of course, the Mirage 2000BR (an advanced Mirage 2000-5 variant) didn't have the Su-35's range, but with a Mirage production line to be open in Brazil and the authorisation to sell and build every Mirage 2000 produce for American continent, it was quite interresting for Brazilian government...

You are right. It´s better to say one of the favourites. SU-35 (performance), Gripen (technical aspects) and Mirage 2000br ("political/economic" ascpects).

But well, maybe a new competition between Rafale and Su-35 in the next years?

I don´t believe in a new competition... Probably Rafale, in a very distant future... :B

[PolluxDeltaSeven]

I don´t believe in a new competition... Probably Rafale, in a very distant future... :B

Okay... So I propose the Rafale with the Su-35's splinter scheme!!      

PS: I'm happy to see so much Brazilian guys here... I have some family in Beo Horizonte and hope comming one day...

[Hammer-nikit]

This is the whole story,

The Mirage 2000Br was to be a fine flyer and competent plane unfortunately Embraer sold a 20% stake of its shares to SNECMA, Dassault, Thales and EADS (Matra then) that way automaticaly aligning with the Mirage proposal and discardin participation in any other aircraft. This created a very uncornfortable situation between them and the Air Force who naturaly believed that a Mirage 2000 for US$70Mi a plane was a definite rip-off.

The Su-35 in the end was considered the best fighter in absolute terms with clearly the best commercial offset proposal. But there were many inside the FAB concerned with the operating costs of such a big plane and of potentialy troublesome post sales support by the Russians. The Gripen was a favorite of the Air Force engeneering world, which admired the compact package and it's advanced eletronic features and network warfare capability.

The F-16 was quickly discarded over US reluctance to share software codes for local weapons integration and systems upgrades as well as BVR missile availlability.

The MiG 29 was never properly represented in Brazil and at the time there were some persistent doubts on its evolutionaty prospects for the future.

The major problem percieved with the Mirage 2000 offer was the genaral notion that soon with the deliveries of the Rafales Mirages would eventualy reach the end of their development condemning the FAB to operating a soon obsolescent aircraft. These fears were apparently were right on the mark as the production line was just closed down..

In the end a lack of coherent opinion from the AirForce generals made it easy for the government to pospone the issue indefinetly with the purchase of used M2000C from the French AdlA.

In the end everybody lost... Too bad. I personally think if by 2010 Dassault has not managed to sell the Rafale to any major foreign client their possibilities of selling it to Brazil would be slim to none...

Let's wait to see if Lula, our current president manages to get re-elected in this year end's election? :| At least we'll have some clue as to where this soap opera is moving to....

Regards, Hammer  

[Hammer-nikit]

By the way Roger the image you posted was drawn by a great friend of mine Mario Maia from Campo Grande MS. He also drew these profiles for me...







Enjoy!

Hammer

[Hammer-nikit]

[Hammer-nikit]

[Hammer-nikit]

[Radish]

BRILLIANT....got an Su-27 somewhere....but don't distract me from biplanes...but BRILLIANT  

[Hammer-nikit]

Which c/s you all liked best?

Regards?

Hammer

[Rogerolim]

Hammer:
Overdose of brazilian flankers! I love that!

I don't  knew these Mario Maia profiles... Thank you!
I really need to buy more flankers    

You explain exactly the situation. Really a  soap opera

Pollux:
Rafale in splinter scheme?, It´s a great idea!  I'll put this on my list.

I live in Sao Paulo, but Belo Horizonte is a beautiful city. you must Come some day! You are welcome.

[lancer]

OK, in response to Toads request, and since I put new batteries in the camera. I would like to present The Avro Anaconda.
When Sukhoi offered Green SU27 airframes to the UK back in the 80's, the Thatcher govt said yes at the urging of the air staff, who seeing the potential of this aircr0aft knew it would be an ideal air defence fighter the the RAF. Initially the first 50 airframes were built by Sukhoi and shipped to the UK for engine and systems fitting, the remianing 150 airframes were licence built by Avro and the type was names the Anaconda, why no one really knows.
The Anaconda F1 went on to equip a number of squadrons, a lot of which were reactivated and several 'famous' fighter squadrons, including 43; 56; 74 and 92 sqns.  The anaconda depicted here is the 56 Sqn 1998 season display aircraft, hence the scheme worn. Although it retains all the lethality of a front line aircraft.

I used the airfix SU27 to build this and I will NEVER use it again! The under carridge is flimsy especially the 2 part front u/c. As can be seen from the underside photo. I will be converting this to an in flight model, just gotta get some 4mm clear rod first. I also need to stick some wore side winders on the wing tips as well.

[GTX]

Hi folks,

Thread revival time!

Upon reading this (which is actually about the civilian aircraft side):

Sukhoi Civil Aircraft and Alenia Aeronautica Announce Completion of the Acquisition of 25% + 1 share in the SCAC Capital

(Source: Sukhoi Civil Aircraft; issued April 7, 2009)

   VNUKOVO AIRPORT, MOSCOW --- Today in the presence of Victor Khristenko, the Russian Minister of Industry and Trade, and Claudio Scajola, Minister of Economic Development, Republic of Italy, Mikhail Pogosyan, Director General of Sukhoi Holding, and Pier Francesco Guarguaglini, Chairman and Chief Executive Officer of Finmeccanica, have officially announced the completion of the acquisition of 25% + 1 share in the SCAC capital.

The value of the stock acquired by Alenia Aeronautica is of USD 183 mln (138 mln euro). This agreement makes the Sukhoi Superjet 100 Program the most relevant aviation partnership between Russia and Europe ever seen.

In 2007 Finmeccanica's company Alenia Aeronautica and Sukhoi Holding formed SuperJet International, a joint venture (51% - Alenia Aeronautica, and 49% - Sukhoi Holding) based in Venice, responsible for marketing, sales and aircraft delivery in Europe, North and South America, Africa, Japan and Oceania as well as for worldwide logistic support for the Sukhoi Superjet 100 regional aircraft family.

The Russian Certification of the Sukhoi Superjet 100 aircraft, which has to date received firm orders for 98 aircraft, is expected by the end of 2009, as well the delivery to the first customer.

Mikhail Pogosyan, Director General of Sukhoi Holding, notes, "The deal closed today means that the biggest alliance between Russia and Italy in the aircraft industry has been fully developed. Further on, Alenia Aeronautica, our strategic partner, will solidify the Sukhoi Superjet 100 market potential worldwide and will provide our product with distinct logistic support".

Pier Francesco Guarguaglini, Finmeccanica's Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, notes: "This agreement is the first fundamental step for an ever broader collaboration between Finmeccanica, Sukhoi and the Russian industry in the aeronautics field and paves the way to more partnerships in other strategic industrial sectors".


Sukhoi Civil Aircraft Company is a Sukhoi Holding company founded in 2000. Headquartered in Moscow, SCAC enjoys branches at its production sites in Komsomolsk-on-Amur, Novosibirsk and Voronezh. Today SCAC employs over 2,000 people.

At present, SCAC's flagship project is the Sukhoi Superjet 100 Program. SSJ100 integrates the best solutions the global aerospace industry can provide. The aircraft will be certified according to both Russian and international regulations. The world market share for Sukhoi Superjet 100 is estimated at 1,040 aircraft by the year 2027. Sukhoi Superjet 100 aftersales support is handled through SuperJet International – a joint venture between Alenia Aeronautica and Sukhoi Company.

The SSJ100 was unveiled to the global aerospace community on September 26, 2007 and it successfully accomplished a 65 min maiden flight on May 19, 2008. Sukhoi Superjet 100's current firm order portfolio totals 98 aircraft. Today the aircraft is conducting a full-scale certification flight program.

Alenia Aeronautica is a Finmeccanica Company. It is the largest Italian aeronautic player which operates world-wide in the commercial and military aviation, unmanned aerial vehicles and aerostructures. Alenia Aeronautica also coordinates the activities of Alenia Aermacchi and Alenia Aeronavali - wholly owned companies – respectively active in the design and manufacturing of military trainer aircraft and in the overhaul, maintenance and modification of military and civil aircraft.

With its joint ventures ATR and Superjet International, Alenia Aeronautica is the world leader in the regional turboprop market and a top player in the regional jet sector. Over 2008 Alenia Aeronautica reported revenues of 2,530 million Euros, backlog for 8,281 million Euro and orders for 2,720. The total workforce is 13,907.

-ends-

I couldn't help but imagine, what if Alenia Aeronautica actually bought into the military side of Sukhoi?  Italian Flankers!!!!

Regards,

Greg