Blackburn P.146...

[Archibald]

Among the "surviving" aircrafts maker in UK in the 60's, the best were clearly Blackburn, Hawker and Vickers. It's interesting to notice how they specialised in the three ways of having STOL / VTOL aircrafts
- Vickers studied the VG wing
- Hawker, VTOL stuff such as lift engines
- Blackburn, the blown flaps.

The latter produced two interesting designs, the P.141 and P.146... those would have been much better aircraft then the F-4K...

I made a P.146 with the reamins of the Mig-27 / Mirage 2000 (after bucthcering them for the Mirage G)

Enjoy!!

[Zen]

Not bad Archie. Another triumph.

[Archibald]

Well this is not my best model, that sure. Have to improve it!! Glad you nevertheless enjoy it...once again, an interesting aircraft for the RN (interesting discussion with you some days ago )

Concerning its bigger brother, the P.141... Well this plane basically look like a "fighter" Jaguar. The dimensions of the two are quite close, but the air intakes are very different. The nose of the P.141 is bigger, as the engines exhausts.
I'm really thinking making this aircraft. Mirages air-intakes, 2000L drop tanks for the nose, Tornado exhausts (yes, the P-141 engines were M-45 but it's nearly impossible to find it. And more commonality with the Tornado would imply
RB-199s).
I have to ask Heller for spares part again...(the service still works despite the bankrupcy of the firm).
I go to Paris this weekend, and to a wonderful model shop named Euromaquette. Hope they'll have a Jaguar...

[Brian da Basher]

Wow Archie you've done it again! She's a real beauty! I really like the camo scheme!

Brian da Basher

[Archibald]

You have to learn me how to make spats... from drop tanks. Thanks all for the nice comments.
I added ordinary stuff to the plane (AIM-9, ventral fins, nose antena, a small fairing below the nose)
Plan RAF roundels obviously (high-viz)...

[Archibald]

I've just discovered that I had never finished this thread...(the aircraft itself is finished for a long time)
some pics...



Now I want to make his bigger brother, the P.141 (maybe more adequate to the RAF requirements, particularly ASR-395 long range interceptor... no Tornado ADV!)
I receive Heller spares needed to modify the Jaguar (both planes have nearly the same length around 17m, but differents exhausts and air intakes, the P.141 has a bigger nose...)

[Geoff_B]

Archie Way off target with this one.

The Jaguar would be a better basis for the P146, with the twin jet pipes being replaced by a single larger jetpipe and the lower rear fusleage being blended into the jet pipe. The nose cone will obviously require a little re-profilling to get the 146 shape. The intakes will need to be replaced by deeper ones and the lower fuselage bulking out to meet them.

For the larger P141 you need to use the F-4 Phantom, as the design was heavily influenced by the Phantom. Afterall the designers of the P141 had helped in anglosizing the Toom. (Yeap the P141 dates after the F-4K as it was intended to replace both the Phantom and Buccaneer !!). The F-4K is virually the same size and shape as the toom, except for the Shoulder mounted wings and shorter rounded intakes. The canopy is also wider and deeper than the toom.

Cheers

Geoff  

[Archibald]

Hmmmm...   to be honest, this P.146 was made from remains left by the Mirage G butchering (Mirage 2000/ MiG-27). No the best thing I made I agree...

For the P.141 I plan to use a model as basis, this would be better...

Concerning the P.141, the Jaguar is not too far in length (16.7m Vs 17m for the P.141) and already have shoulder mounted wings.
The air intakes: as in the TSR-2, they are Mirage-like (round with shock cones)
I still have the air intakes from the Mirage F1 but maybe biggers intakes would be necessary. If this occure, I will once again ask Heller...

The other day I compared the intakes of a Jag and 2000, and something interesting is the 2000 intakes fit perfectly on the Jag (1.2 cm wide) , the result beeing similar to the plan of the P.141 figuring in B.S.P... (you know I'm a great fan of the book )
I also looked carefully the Jag canopy and it look quite similar to the P.141. The nose differs considerably, but I have my plan for that

A part from B.S.P, is there others pics of the Blackburn P.141 somewhere ?  

[Archibald]

Two more things

- 1 were does the nickname "Toom" come from ? Phantoom ?
2- Thorvic you intriguate me with the Phantom. I tried to compare the three (Jag, Phantom and P.141... what name for the latter ?)
(the P.141 beeing a raw drawing only, it is not as good as the detailed 3-view from Avions légendaires.com)

[Geoff_B]

Don't compare the the F-4E as this has the elongataed nose, you need to use a F-4B/D version or better yet the K. No better drawings of the P141 but do have details on its design from the Roy Boot booj " From Spitfire to Eurofighter" that covers the Buccaneer and most of Blackburns/HS Brough's designs and their evolution.

Believe me the P141 was derived from the toom. Yeap the Jag or Mitsubushi T-1 canopy would be more suitable. A buccaneers may even do the trick. The jag fuselage is just out in most dimensions and shape, but close enougth to match the 146.

Cheers

Geoff

[Archibald]

I believe you! The plane looks like a mix between a Jag and a Phantom.

The real problem is the P.146 is smaller than the Jaguar (I found 15.5 m against 16.8m for the Jag). The P.141 at 17.1 m is between the Jag and a Phantom (short nose: 17.7m and long nose around 19m ).
(damn! I start talking like a JMN...)

[Archibald]

Well, ok I admit my defeat
You were perfectly right! So I changed my plan
- I scrap my old P-146, recycling the air intakes, decals and maybe the exhaust
- The Jag I wanted to change into a P.141 will become the P.146, as you suggested
- My toom will be sacrificed to become the P.141... (well I have to buy another Toom, but it's not too difficult to find )
I have a lot of work on my workbench...

In fact the P.141 was really an improved  Phantom (with modern engines, high wings and Mirage-like air intakes, and modular building to ease maintenance and building)... and nothing more!