Ekranoplan and WIG (Wing In Ground effect)

[PolluxDeltaSeven]

The WIG are far more resistant to AAM than air liners, and that for many reasons...

-They are bigger!! If you need one or two missiles to shot down a A320 which weight 77 tons, you probably need much more missiles for a 1000 tons aircraft!!!!

-Due to the conception of the WIG, they could have better armor...

-Due to the flight altitude, their is less risks of depressurisations. If the fuselage is perforated, their is quite no risk of explosion and if the damages are too heavy, the WIG could land (well, land on th sea?? What is the good english word for that)...
In fact, destroying a WIG is much more like destroying a ship than destroying a heavy bomber...

- actual big turbofans have low IR signature (because 90% of the exhaust plume is cold air)

Well, I don't think this is really important!! All the missiles you quote are radar guided!!
And if you can reduce the IR signature of the WIG (but it will probably be the IR signature of a little airliner whatever), you won't reduce the radar signature of such a montser!!




If we imagine that more WIG became operationnals, including for littoral anti-ship missions, we could imagine that the western navies had develop new missiles, or transform already existing missiles to become WIG-killers...

For me, the best solution could be a new supersonic missile, developped for both anti-WIG and anti-ship missions!! Something the size of the Exocet for example...
Maybe an anti-ship ASMP??

Or maybe, as an interim solution, an Exocet or a Harpoon with new guidance system (the only problem will be that they have reduce range if they are launch behind the WIG instead that in front of it)...

[Runway ? ...]

If I remember rightly. WIGs (in their time) flew too low for radar and radar guided stuff (too much clutter), too high for sonar and mines, too cool for heatseekers, too fast for boats to intercept and were built like ships so they'd take a bit of small arms fire. Potentionally a damn fine asset for a shock army to own    

Slightly biased - Vic of KM under my monitor    

[Archibald]

The Australian Metalstorm guns will probably become very useful for missile defence. Able to loose off 1 million rounds per minute (I kid you not) with little recoil & engage three seperate targets in around a second, it can put a wall of lead up against the most determined missile attack. A 40mm version has just been put into production & the intention is to convert most gun based weapons to this technology. Useful to have have when piitted against an Ekranoplan missile cruiser. Also the ability to put round after round in exactly the same spot will render most armour ineffective.

I red the article you mentioned on this forum. Aparently this is as revolutionary as the Gatling and Maxims machine-guns at their times.  

supersonic ASM ? there was this program in France but it was put on hold some years ago (ANS if I remember well). Something interesting is the russians ASM are already supersonic (particularly the KH-31, Bhramos and others). So we could have a huge fight between surface vessels and Ekranoplans, both firing ASMs    

and were built like ships

In fact, destroying a WIG is much more like destroying a ship than destroying a heavy bomber...

I totally agree with that. An armored ship aka a battleship... a high-speed, flying (small) battleship!!!

The russians had another terrific weapon, the Shkval (not sure of the name). you know, the high-speed torpedo using MHD. An Ekranoplan with Shkvals and Brahmos would be a terrific adversary, even for the Supercarriers...

I haven't thought about that, but a WHIG would beat Helicopters in speed and probably range...

[Runway ? ...]

Archie,
If you'd like a big firefight scenario and you're introducing metalstorm, how about as Mossie suggested lasers. How about letting the WIG craft have "frikkin lasers   " , They've got  more than enough room for kind of that stuff and, ok, the effects of spray will effect the performance but It'd be an even more bizarre fight    


Skval is a strange weapon. From what I understand it seems to reduce the combat to a duel. One guy fires (his effectively unguided weapon) first and if he misses the other guy knows exactly where to aim with no chances to move or hide on either side. Not a place I'd like to be.

I do hope you're going to build some of these to save me cutting mine up    

[Archibald]

That's becoming pure sci-fi !!!  
Hmm an Ekranoplan with the laser turret of the YaL-1...on its back?  

[Runway ? ...]

Yeah !  Death beams coming out of a turret on the front of the fin of a Loon.
That's surely a whatif worthy of a place in War of the Worlds.
The scariest thing is if somebody had enough money they could really build it  

Edit: Nurse says It's my bedtime

[Archibald]

As would say alanis Morissette "jagg little pills" ...  

[JC Carbonel]

from what I understand these monsters had a relatively high ceiling (well high is a relative word but it was in the hundred of meters ... so it could probably flew against a poor weather / high waves ....but probably at the expanse of range ....


JCC

[PolluxDeltaSeven]

Somebody have more information or links about the Metalstorm guns???
Seams to be incredible!!

from what I understand these monsters had a relatively high ceiling (well high is a relative word but it was in the hundred of meters ... so it could probably flew against a poor weather / high waves ....but probably at the expanse of range ....

That's true. I don't know for the old Ekranoplan (I doubt, because of the size of the monsters) but the WIG that were studied during the 1990's and the WIG beeing studied those days have a capacity of real flight... I mean, they could fly like an airplane or like an ekranoplan...

Of course, when they fly like planes, they had to have lighter weight, and they have a lesser range...

Such a capacity is not maid to be very used. In fact, the WIG are really an economic solution facing the classic airliners when they fly in WIG mode. The classic flying capacity is done only for exeptionnal flights, over some land or when the weather is very bad...

It all depends on the particular aircraft, of course, but I guess that a WIG/classical convertible aircraft had to make something like more than 80% of its operationnal time as a pure WIG if it want to be a viable solution facing the airliners...

[Archibald]

hmm if I understand well, the engines are placed like that to blow the wing and augmenting the lift cushion ?
glad you enjoy this thread, guys.

[Archibald]

I remember this daring project from boeing, the Pelican (1500 tos or so, can't remember exactly). what happened to it ?  

[Mossie]

Somebody have more information or links about the Metalstorm guns???
Seams to be incredible!!

It is pretty incredible Pollux, but it's real.  The head of the Australian Metal Storm company thought that the current gun was largely outdated & relied on mechanics that hadn't changed much in three hundred years.  He decided to apply electronics to the gun concept & realised that fire rates could increase by a thousand fold.

The weapons include no moving parts so re-coil is largely eliminated.  Fire rates can be varied from a single round shot to the million a minute mark, although there were several delvelopmental problems, not suprising with something of this magnitude.  Theres been a few posts about it over the last few months, it's probably about time there was a thread on it.  I'll start after I've had my dinner!

[rallymodeller]

IIRC the USN is (or was) looking at Metalstorm-type guns to replace Phalanx for CIWS duties.

Link to Metalstorm's website: Metalstorm, Ltd.

[Archibald]

Au fait! we can fit a Metalstorm turret on the Ekranoplan!!!!

Now that would be something...Brahmos, shkvals, Laser and metallstorm  fired from a WIG aircraft, attacking a supercarrier or other surface vessels... the ultimate weapon!!

In the thread about the Metalstorm, someone suggested to make a superdefiant with a turret metalstorm... we can try that with a Typhoon!!!    

[The Rat]

In the thread about the Metalstorm, someone suggested to make a superdefiant with a turret metalstorm...

Ah, that would be me.  ^_^

Maybe I could retrofit one on the Rayador? After all, it's an Ekranoplan!