F22 considered by Japan

[Eddie M.]

As Sisko said, the USAF is keen to push through export to Japan.  Given how they are barely getting enough airframes to fulfil their basic responsibilities, it makes sense to have loyal allies with their own F-22 fleet.  Raptors in Japan means the USAF has less of a need to base a wing/squadron there.

Regarding the use of the word Japanese, old-timers will remember that Tom has in the past asked us to refrain from its use.  He's oriental, and he's the big cheese, so thats all we need to know, regardless of the hypocrisy of some who complaining about it.

I agree about letting the Japanese have the Raptor. After being stationed there, I have found them to be one of our most trusted allies (and some of the nicest people on this planet).

I second your second as well. The irony is the PC cop is going to bat for people who think of him as nothing more than Gaijin. They may be some of the nicest folks around, but when it comes down to brass tacks....Gaijin.
  Eddie  

[lancer]

I still like the YF-23A more...sexier plane!

Amen to that

[Captain Canada]

I agree about the -23.....that thing was just so cool looking ! The boy has a 72nd scale plastic toy, with retractable landing gear. I 'fly' it around the house almost every day !

 

[elmayerle]

I still like the YF-23A more...sexier plane!

Not only that, but from the flight test data reports I saw at the time, it was the better performer, able to go supersonic and cruise there without using 'burners.  From all I've read and heard, Northrop lost it in the management phase of the evaluation, not the performance or technical phases.

[Hatchet]

I still like the YF-23A more...sexier plane!

Not only that, but from the flight test data reports I saw at the time, it was the better performer, able to go supersonic and cruise there without using 'burners.  From all I've read and heard, Northrop lost it in the management phase of the evaluation, not the performance or technical phases.

Uh, the F-22 is able to cruise supersonic without burners too

From what I picked up, the -23 was stealthier, but the -22 had better maneouverability.

[SimonR]

This  is a picture of the best looking Japanese I've ever seen.

[Hobbes]

Uh, the F-22 is able to cruise supersonic without burners too

Yes, but that's not the same thing. It's harder to accelerate to supersonic speeds than to sustain them. It's quite possible the F-22 needs afterburners to go from Mach 0.9 to 1.5 and can then turn them off. Being able to accelerate to M1.5 without using the afterburners at all is more of an achievement.  

[Mossie]

I remember a comment that was made by a senior figure in the ATF program (a USAF General I think).  He was asked wether one of the designs was stealthier, one was faster, & one was more manouverable.  In response, he said (roughly) "It's not true to say that one is particularly more manouverable, & it is not true to say that one is particularly more stealthy".  Quoting this off memory so I may not have qoute 100% right.

The inference was that one design was superior, but in speed only.

[Son of Damian]

From what I picked up, the -23 was stealthier, but the -22 had better maneouverability

The YF-23 was faster, stealthier, and cheaper because it used parts from other aircraft already in production, landing gear from the F-18 & instrument panel from the F-15E strike eagle.  

[Zen]

That was only for the machines they flew, had they won then the F23 would have evolved quite heavily before becoming production machines. I doubt you'd see any cost savings in the end or direct lifts of parts from any other aircraft.

[Shasper]

On the contrary, I believe that the F-23 production A/C would have kept some of it's "borrowed" anatomy.

SHas B)

[anthonyp]

Paging Evan, please report to the F-23 discussion thread.

Evan, to the F-23 discussion thread, please.  Thank you!

[elmayerle]

On the contrary, I believe that the F-23 production A/C would have kept some of it's "borrowed" anatomy.

Well, not perhaps as much as you'd think.  I rather suspect the production version would have refined several aspects to where they'd not necessarily be common to other aircraft.

One published aspect of the production F-23 proposal that I really liked was that the bulkhead between the two weapons bays was moveable, like that between the front two weapons bays on the B-1B; allowing for the internal carriage of larger munitions when required.  I'm splicing a couple YF-23 kits together to add the length for the extra weapons bay of a F-23.  I admit to being highly tempted to do an advanced version incorporating the aerodynamics of the X-35/F-35 inlets to reduce fab. costs while maintaining the same or better RCS and performance.

[Radish]

glad we're talkining about aircraft again chaps.

People call me lots of things all the time and I never take offence, just look either amused or bemused.
But that's me.

Nice PINK F-22 by the way.

And the F-23 looked so much more interesting too.

[Mossie]

Glad theres at least one other sane one around Radish.

I just spotted the Pink F-22 on Google Images while doing a search, thought I had to share it!

I agree, the F-23 just looks better.  The same with the McDD JAST/JSF proposal, I was gutted when that one was the first out of the competition.

It often seems the most interesting designs seem to loose out, probably because they're pushing the envelope a wee bit, but it's a shame from a modelling point of view!