Real World Aircraft Companies

[Maverick]

Hi All

Does anyone know of a single source on the net where the conglomeration of US aircraft companies ended up as Northrop-Grumman-Boeing-Lockheed-Martin or whatever they're called today?

I'm specifically after a timeline deliniating the change or merger from the fledgleing aviation companies, like when Lockheed was spelt Loughheed to today's Super Corporations.

Does such a thing exist?

In addition, is there a similar thing for BAe (eg from the Sopwith days up until BAe Systems)?

I ask primarily for my designations of profiles given the appropriate time-frames etc.

Thanks in advance

Mav

[jcf]

Ken Shanaberger has a pretty good site of aviation manufacturer thumbnail histories.

Manufacturers

Some info has been superceded, the Vought section for instance needs to be updated...
here is more current info:
Ownership Changes
In 1992, Ling-Temco-Vought (LTV) sells assets of its aircraft division to The Carlyle Group and Northrop Corp. Two years later, Northrop, following its acquisition of Grumman Corp., buys the remaining 51 percent of the Dallas and Grand Prairie operations from Carlyle. In July 2000, The Carlyle Group buys Northrop Grumman's aerostructures business. The business is renamed Vought Aircraft Industries, Inc. and remains based in Dallas.

In July 2003, Vought Aircraft Industries purchases The Aerostructures Corp, with manufacturing sites in Nashville, Tenn.; Brea, Calif.; and Everett, Wash.

http://www.vought.com/newsFactGallery/fact...ny/atGlance.htm

For BAE , from Wikipedia, 1955-2000



I started on a similar chart for US industry a couple of years back, but I lost interest...mebbe I should revisit the project.

Cheers, Jon

[Maverick]

Absolutely brilliant Jon,

Thanks so very much, exactly what I was after without trudging up every internet superhighway.

Regards,

Mav

[anthonyp]

We're actually BAE Systems (no little e)   B)  

[Maverick]

Nice point Tony,

what's with the change, it used to be BAe now BAE Systems?

 

[kitnut617]

I'd say that the time line isn't very accurate, Avro for instance was bought out by Hawker in the early to middle 1930's as was a number of other well known companies.

Robert

[jcf]

I'd say that the time line isn't very accurate, Avro for instance was bought out by Hawker in the early to middle 1930's as was a number of other well known companies.

Robert

The following is various bits from Putnam histories.

A. V. Roe sold his interest in the company to Sir John Siddeley, the head of Armstrong Whitworth, in 1928.

In 1934 Hawker purchased Gloster outright, in 1935 Sopwith announced the formation of a Trust to acquire all shares of the Armstrong Siddeley Development Company Ltd, and the formation of a public holding company to be known as the Hawker-Siddeley Aircraft Company Ltd. At the same time the Hawker-Gloster combine subscribed half its share capital to the new company, but maintained a large degree of autonomy by virtue of retaining one million pounds capital a a private company in its own right. Thus, at a stroke, a powerful group of companies hadbeen brought together such as could not be found elsewhere in the industry. It included Sir W G Armstrong Whitworth Aircraft Ltd, Armstrong Siddeley Motors Ltd, Air Service Training Ltd, and A V Roe & Co Ltd, in additio to Hawkers and Glosters. (note: except for Gloster this conglomeration was not a buyout in modern terms such as Boeing-MacDac-NAA or Lockheed-Martin, the various HS divisions retained their names along with separate design and manufacture capability until the 'realignments' of the late 50s - early 60s and competed with each other for the same contracts).

On July 1, 1963, the great name of Avro disappeared when the company was restyled the Avro-Whitworth Division of Hawker Siddeley Aviation Ltd. From that date the Avro 748, which was then in production, became the H.S.748.

Gloster Aircraft also ceased to exist on July 1, 1963.


The name change to BAE Systems was made to reflect that BAE is more than 'just' aerospace, and to tie into the hot jargon of 'system'-centric, Future Combat 'System' etcetera etcetera. Boeing's military side is Integrated Defense Systems. Corporate wanking.

Cheers, Jon

[Maverick]

Thanks for the info Jon, had a funny feeling Avro were still around during WW2 at least, lol.  As for corporate wanking, can't say i'm awfully surprised, the days of letting your products speak for themselves are long gone by the looks.

Regards,

John

[anthonyp]

Nice point Tony,

what's with the change, it used to be BAe now BAE Systems?

Well, at one time, we were just British Aerospace (BAe... which just looks cooler to me for some reason), then we went acquisition nuts.  Actually, THEY went acquisition nuts, as we were UDLP before 2005.  After getting more than just aerospace firms, they went to BAE Systems, to show the more diversified and larger scope of the company.

I've heard from various people that BAE actually stands for British Aerospace and Engineering, but I think that was just them making something up to fit a question they had no real answer for.

[kitnut617]

I'd say that the time line isn't very accurate, Avro for instance was bought out by Hawker in the early to middle 1930's as was a number of other well known companies.

Robert

The following is various bits from Putnam histories.

A. V. Roe sold his interest in the company to Sir John Siddeley, the head of Armstrong Whitworth, in 1928.

In 1934 Hawker purchased Gloster outright, in 1935 Sopwith announced the formation of a Trust to acquire all shares of the Armstrong Siddeley Development Company Ltd, and the formation of a public holding company to be known as the Hawker-Siddeley Aircraft Company Ltd. At the same time the Hawker-Gloster combine subscribed half its share capital to the new company, but maintained a large degree of autonomy by virtue of retaining one million pounds capital a a private company in its own right. Thus, at a stroke, a powerful group of companies hadbeen brought together such as could not be found elsewhere in the industry. It included Sir W G Armstrong Whitworth Aircraft Ltd, Armstrong Siddeley Motors Ltd, Air Service Training Ltd, and A V Roe & Co Ltd, in additio to Hawkers and Glosters. (note: except for Gloster this conglomeration was not a buyout in modern terms such as Boeing-MacDac-NAA or Lockheed-Martin, the various HS divisions retained their names along with separate design and manufacture capability until the 'realignments' of the late 50s - early 60s and competed with each other for the same contracts).

On July 1, 1963, the great name of Avro disappeared when the company was restyled the Avro-Whitworth Division of Hawker Siddeley Aviation Ltd. From that date the Avro 748, which was then in production, became the H.S.748.

Gloster Aircraft also ceased to exist on July 1, 1963.


The name change to BAE Systems was made to reflect that BAE is more than 'just' aerospace, and to tie into the hot jargon of 'system'-centric, Future Combat 'System' etcetera etcetera. Boeing's military side is Integrated Defense Systems. Corporate wanking.

Cheers, Jon

I see where you're coming from, but if someone was to see the chart for the first time and not know much about the ins-and-outs of the industry, it would suggest that Avro joined HS in 1960. Especially as it's on the Wikipedia site.

[Riksbar]

I've heard from various people that BAE actually stands for British Aerospace and Engineering

When I worked for them most of us said it stood for Big And Expensive.

BAE SYSTEMS (I recall it was supposed to be all capitalised before the corporate identity people gave up trying to enforce that one) is also an anagram of MESSY BEAST.

[jcf]

I see where you're coming from, but if someone was to see the chart for the first time and not know much about the ins-and-outs of the industry, it would suggest that Avro joined HS in 1960. Especially as it's on the Wikipedia site.

The chart just shows when they were 'assimilated'.  

Cheers, Jon

[Maverick]

Bloody Borgs, who would have thought they were working for Hawker-Siddley???

     

and no, I'm not a ST fan, just love that word 'assimilate'

Regards,

Mav