Double Swallow

[luft46models]

I was reading the April SAMI and noticed that the Ki61 is called Hien which in japanese means swallow much as Scwalbe in German means swallow so my mind went spinning off to what you would get if you combined two Swallows.

The obvious back story would be the Me 262 plans arrived but without the fuselage details - some stuff up along the way eg a lost sub etc as the Germans did ship the Me 262 and 163 details to the japanese. The Japanese then decide to just use the Hien for the fuselage as it's closest to hand. ( yes there are holes that I'm sure can be poked in this )

So from a model making and engineering viewpoint i'm going to use a Ki61 fuselage ( possibly stretched ) with a 262 wing. Obviously the engine comes out of the front but we keep the Ki61 propellor boss and maybe mount a big gun and fuel tanks . The other change is it now becomes a tail sitter wih the Ki61 tailwheel altho this may need to be changed.

If anybody has any thoughts on how best to do this I would be grateful.

William in Oz  

[Archibald]

Yeah, many aircrafts were named Swallow. Don't forget the DH-108, and there was some french aircraft (a Dassault transport of the 60's) named... Hirondelle    

Maybe your result would be similar to the Re 2007, a RUMORED italian jet of WWII (basically a Re 2005 with... a 262 engine). Interestingly, the Re-2005 and Ki.61 were rather similar...  

[Archibald]

So this would be a Japanese Swallow rather than an European swallow, but what would be its speed when loaded with a coconut ?  

[luft46models]

I'd love to do a 244th scheme but NMF scare me too much, probably more green and grey and that bloody yellow strip. I must say I did consider 4 30mm guns for the B-29's but thought a big gun might be more fun. Archibald love the European swallow comment  

Should I go the 1/72 Dragon or Hasegawa Hien 1- I did the Hase one 30 odd years ago and it has nice sentimental memories

tempted to reuse one of the spare MPM 262 wings I've got lying around - not great but damned cheap.

William in Oz

[PanzerWulff]

Actually the first ME 262's were tailsitters but they found the layout unsatisfactory as the jet blast bouncing off the ground interfered with the tail controls,the ingenius pilots overcame this by getting up to speed and "Tapping" the brakes causing the tail to swing up then immediately pulling up to get the aircraft off the ground



As for a big gun they did mount a 50mm on a 262

I hope these help you out
"Panzer"

[GTX]

Obviously the engine comes out of the front but we keep the Ki61 propellor boss and maybe mount a big gun and fuel tanks . The other change is it now becomes a tail sitter wih the Ki61 tailwheel altho this may need to be changed.

So, am I reading this correctly that this would only be a single engined job, maybe a little bit like the Yak-15:



Regards,

Greg

[B777LR]

blasting bomber formations outta my way in Combat Flight Simulator using the -262 really is a blast  B)  

[Daryl J.]

Dr. Daryl wonders if you are having a swallowing problem!

:dum:  :dum:  :dum:
Daryl J. with the dry joke of the day

[elmayerle]

Obviously the engine comes out of the front but we keep the Ki61 propellor boss and maybe mount a big gun and fuel tanks . The other change is it now becomes a tail sitter wih the Ki61 tailwheel altho this may need to be changed.

So, am I reading this correctly that this would only be a single engined job, maybe a little bit like the Yak-15:

If you went this way with a single jet engine, a quick look at a Ki-61 kit says that the main landing gear is spaced outboard enough for this to work.

[luft46models]

I was wondering who would make a joke about the double swallow   . I definitely want a twin engine job tho.

William in Oz

[Geoff]

I'd love to do a 244th scheme but NMF scare me too much, probably more green and grey and that bloody yellow strip. I must say I did consider 4 30mm guns for the B-29's but thought a big gun might be more fun.



William in Oz

The 244th had a number of schemes, some only had a coloured tail with +/- a fuselage stripe in various colours. Home defense aircraft had white bands under the Hinomaru as an ID for the flak gunners.

Do not be put off trying a NMF finish I use an acrillic spray can. (from Halfords in the UK; Mercades Silver, or Nissan Silver are good. Sorry do not know the Oz equivilents) With a little practise these give good results, and if its not quite right well the IJAAF cammoed a lot of their aircraft in the field quite crudly, so a rough dapple of green over any flaws will hide a lot.

http://www.aircraftresourcecenter.com/life...likedecal72.htm

[Radish]

Also, yellow leading edges are nicely dealt with by decal sheet....I bought a couple of yellow sheets....extremely useful!

Car spray's a wonderful thing.
NEVER store then upright, always tilted or on their sides.
Always shake well.......I quite annoy the wife by sitting in the lounge (or wherever she is) shaking the tin.....but then i get smacked

For the "combining the Swallow" idea, I thought of a zwilling...one fuselage Ki-61, the other Me-262.
Silly me.

And the Swallow is the bird of love, right? B)
Should it have heart markings?

[GTX]

I definitely want a twin engine job tho.

Maybe two engines side-by-side in the nose (a bit like the Hispano Ha-200 - see below), but with the exhaust still exiting under the fuselage like the Yak-15?




As for cannon, here are a selection of heavy cannon, the Japanese used during the war (I've kept to Japanese Army weapons given that I assume this would be a Japanese Army Air Force Aircraft):

Ho-105 30 mm cannon - used on some Nakajima Ki-84s;
Ho-155 30 mm cannon;
Ho-155-II 30mm cannon;
Ho-203 37 mm cannon - used on some Nakajima Ki-44, Kawasaki Ki-45 aircraft;
Ho-204 37 mm cannon;
Ho-301 40 mm cannon - actually saw limited use on some Nakajima Ki-44 aircraft. It was unusual in using caseless ammunition. Although the effective range of the cannon was only 150 meters (490 ft), Ho-301 was light and rapid-firing for its caliber;
Ho-401 57 mm cannon - used on some Kawasaki Ki-102s;
Ho-402 57 mm cannon;
Type 88 75 mm cannon - was experimentally fitted to a Ki-109 bomber in an attempt to reach the American B-29 bombers.

Regards,

Greg

[luft46models]

Thanks guys for the thoughts - would probably lean towards the Ki109 cannon but not sure if the distance from nose on the Hien to prop would be long enough so maybe a 57mm will have to do
I like both the single engine and side by side ideas but I'm trying to make this a quick build as I've been in a bit of a slump lately

And yes the swallow is the bird of love - you naughty boy!

William in Oz  

[ysi_maniac]

I definitely want a twin engine job tho.

Maybe two engines side-by-side in the nose (a bit like the Hispano Ha-200 - see below), but with the exhaust still exiting under the fuselage like the Yak-15?




As for cannon, here are a selection of heavy cannon, the Japanese used during the war (I've kept to Japanese Army weapons given that I assume this would be a Japanese Army Air Force Aircraft):

Ho-105 30 mm cannon - used on some Nakajima Ki-84s;
Ho-155 30 mm cannon;
Ho-155-II 30mm cannon;
Ho-203 37 mm cannon - used on some Nakajima Ki-44, Kawasaki Ki-45 aircraft;
Ho-204 37 mm cannon;
Ho-301 40 mm cannon - actually saw limited use on some Nakajima Ki-44 aircraft. It was unusual in using caseless ammunition. Although the effective range of the cannon was only 150 meters (490 ft), Ho-301 was light and rapid-firing for its caliber;
Ho-401 57 mm cannon - used on some Kawasaki Ki-102s;
Ho-402 57 mm cannon;
Type 88 75 mm cannon - was experimentally fitted to a Ki-109 bomber in an attempt to reach the American B-29 bombers.

Regards,

Greg

What you men is MiG-9 layout. No?