Design By Comittee Part 2

[Mossie]

I'm with Eddie, I like 'K'.  This form is known as a 'Falcon' wing & was trialed on the Fw 190 V19:
http://www.geocities.com/unicraftmodels/ge...fwv19/fwv19.htm

I'm getting ahead now, but I'm thinking of the tail/canard surfaces.  Triangular horizontal tails on the wing bend?  V-large, slightly swept canards; more of a tandem wing than canard?  With the tandem wing, your probably looking at a mud mover, slower, but very agile.

[HOG]

Hiya All
thanks for the replies:-
from the Bader Bus Co
"No No its gotta be wing 'B', and do them foldable"
For foldable would mean navalizing with tail hooks etc, and foldable would mean losing the stabilizing effect of the outrigger wheels,.....BUT if I fold the wing up at the root  and down at the middle join, poss` a dio with crew figures doing the wing fold.... hmmm very interestink..I`ll have a think.
Mossie,
not quite sure what your ideas are here, doodle and post please.

By the way would like to end the wing vote on next Tues 30 Oct at say midnight my time as at the moment I`m really enjoying this and want to keep up the pace.

Keep it incoming, regards Gary

[jcf]

I'm with Eddie and Mossie, the 'K' design is very cool.
Aside from the German falcon wing it was also used as the M-wing on supersonic designs from Bristol, Vickers and Armstrong-Whitworth:



Cheers, Jon

[elmayerle]

Put in my vote for "K", too.  Especially if you can put some "interesting" pods at the point where sweep changes.

[HOG]

Heyo Agins,

So far it`s
B  x1
D  x1
K  x4
But heres another little thing I was playing with last night. Now think of the wing section between the root and the mid way pod. Looking from the front should they be up-middle or down or maybe like clock hands at 1 & 11,  3 & 9  or 5 & 7 o`clock, and the outer section will allways have the tip near ground level. Personally I think horizontal so I can hang stuff from them  but this is D by C.
With regards to the mid wing pods so far its either a medium cannon or missile pods.
Question  Does anyone know if the germans were working on miniguns or gatling guns for these pods

As always Keep It Incoming!
Regards,

PS Mossie whats a mud mover?

[Mossie]

A Mud-Mover is ground attack or strike aircraft, so-called because it's bombs etc literally 'move mud'.

Here's a link to a three view of the Miles M.39, that'll show you what I mean about the canard surface.:
http://richard.ferriere.free.fr/3vues/m39_...ibellula_3v.jpg

For a triangular horizontal tail something roughly along the lines of a Mirage III's tail is what I mean, although longer & shorter:
http://richard.ferriere.free.fr/3vues/mirage3e_3v.jpg

Greg (GTX) is one to ask about German aircraft armament, he has a fair bit of info, he might be able to find you a gatling gun or some other exotic cannon.

[BadersBusCompany]

A visual to support my suggestion for wing 'B'

[jcf]

The Germans had no multi-barrel Gatling-type cannon projects... actually nobody in the 'modern' era did much with the rotary cannon until 1945 when Col. Studler of the U.S. Army Ordnance Research and Development decided to put an electric motor on a Gatling. The conversion was done by Johnson Automatics Inc, of Providence, Rhode Island. The Gatling was a Model 1883 ten-barrel in .45/70 caliber, the weapon was sourced by F. Bannerman and Sons of New York. The first tests were made in late 1945. This was not the first electrically driven Gatling, the first example was built as a test in 1893 and achieved a cyclic rate of 3,000 rpm. The RAF had given consideration to mounting a Gatling on the Westland F.7/30 fighter project.

I digress, the German's did experiment with revolver cannon, podded battery fire weapons and automatic rocket launchers.

I'll scan and post some stuff later on the battery weapons, I've posted the R4M launcher info on a previous thread.

Jon

[HOG]

The Germans had no multi-barrel Gatling-type cannon projects... actually nobody in the 'modern' era did much with the rotary cannon until 1945 when Col. Studler of the U.S. Army Ordnance Research and Development decided to put an electric motor on a Gatling. The conversion was done by Johnson Automatics Inc, of Providence, Rhode Island. The Gatling was a Model 1883 ten-barrel in .45/70 caliber, the weapon was sourced by F. Bannerman and Sons of New York. The first tests were made in late 1945. This was not the first electrically driven Gatling, the first example was built as a test in 1893 and achieved a cyclic rate of 3,000 rpm. The RAF had given consideration to mounting a Gatling on the Westland F.7/30 fighter project.

I digress, the German's did experiment with revolver cannon, podded battery fire weapons and automatic rocket launchers.

I'll scan and post some stuff later on the battery weapons, I've posted the R4M launcher info on a previous thread.

Jon

Heyo All

Jon
Very interesting info. I`m looking for somthing more interesting than just a gun barrel sticking out of the mid wing pods and your dateline of `45 just nearly fits in with the `46+ timeline and has precedence as well. My other considered alternative is some 1:72 nose cones for multi rocket lauchers in an attempt of multi launch small calibre rockets that would result from the low wing loading at this weak joint.

Bader Bus Co
Nice Work, very much in line with my thoughts on this build, but at the moment your outvoted 4-1 so get some friends to help.

As always keep it coming,
regards Garyl
 

[jcf]

Heyo All

Jon
Very interesting info. I`m looking for somthing more interesting than just a gun barrel sticking out of the mid wing pods and your dateline of `45 just nearly fits in with the `46+ timeline and has precedence as well. My other considered alternative is some 1:72 nose cones for multi rocket lauchers in an attempt of multi launch small calibre rockets that would result from the low wing loading at this weak joint.

Gary,
did you see the the other info I posted in the General Modelling area ?
WWII German Aircraft Weapon Projects

Jon

[HOG]

Hi Jon,
Thanks for these, of the two the recoiless cannon is the more interesting, as this has the exhuast venting visable on the exterior.
 

[HOG]

Heyo All
Incometh the 3rd

Work progresses as below
The "spatz" or wheel fairings have been added along with some work to the engine.








The front is from a Fujimi 1:72 bomb rack with some sanded sprue for streamlining, and the rear from I think a Matchbox Heyford? cut down. When I phoned my local hobbyshop the estimated delivery time for the EMA tubing was 4 weeks so as he could make up the order minimum, so I am now building from assorted tube and rod.

A couple of quick shots with the wheels temp` in place.





Also here is a quick plan of how the wings etc will look

I`ve finally thought of a name for this as on the doodle which I`m told is German for Falcon.
A reminder to cast your vote for a wing shape by Tues next week, at last count it`s  1x B 1x D and 4x K (as per doodle as B + D are similar)

Not much input lately,    
Regards

Gary
PS Looking at some of these pic`s theres about 4 or 5 group build projects I could enter this in  

[McGreig]

An amazing build.    I'd also go for wing "K". It not only looks good but it is reminiscent of real projects, such as the Soviet Belyayev Babochka (Butterfly) as well as those already mentioned above.

However, now that I see the project in 3D, I think that the flat ground angle looks a bit odd and that lengthened nose U/C legs might be better, maybe in trouser fairings or spats if they have to be non-retractable.  

[philp]

I don't know.
To me it looks like you have a great looking entry for next years Land Speed Record GB  B)  

[Brian da Basher]

I'm amazed how fast and sleek this bird looks even without wings, HOG! Needless to say, I think your wheel fairings are a touch of genius.

Brian da Basher