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Discussion: F-14, F-15 Hybrid Idea

Started by KJ_Lesnick, May 04, 2008, 09:22:23 PM

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KJ_Lesnick

#210
December 26, 2008, 11:02:49 AM
GTX,

QuoteGenerally not - they usually believe they have the best concept/design themselves.  They may however 'copy' (using this term very carefully) some aspects - something along the lines of "gee that's a good idea, we may do something similar".

That's kind of what I meant. 


KJ Lesnick
That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.

KJ_Lesnick

#211
December 27, 2008, 07:33:44 PM
I'm wondering how to effectively shorten the inlet a bit to enable it to fit reasonably under the chine (probably where the chine meets the rest of the wing's leading-edge) and yet still be able to realistically be able to achieve the high-speed performance I'm going for (able to catch a MiG-25) or as close to.

Any ideas?


KJ Lesnick
That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.

ElectrikBlue

#212
December 28, 2008, 06:22:37 AM
May I suggest this EagleCat as a F-14, F-15, Mig-29 hybrid?  ;D

Regards to all,

EB

KJ_Lesnick

#213
January 01, 2009, 05:06:54 PM
ElectrikBlue,

QuoteMay I suggest this EagleCat as a F-14, F-15, Mig-29 hybrid?  ;D

Not a bad editing job!  It's a great design, but my idea was a bit different though. 

For example...
-  The proposal I was going for was a twin-crew design.
-  The wing-body fairings/twin-boom set-up is too fat.  I'm thinking of the twin-boom area (the back of the chines where the vertical and horizontal stab connect to) shouldn't be any bigger than the F-16.
-  The wing I was going for was slightly higher swept
-  The chines were never intended to be that broad (Look at reply #196/page 14 in this thread see chined fighter depicted in post)
-  The fuselage was supposed to be about as low as on the F-14 or F-15.  Not high up like on the MiG-29


KJ
That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.

KJ_Lesnick

#214
January 01, 2009, 05:10:45 PM Last Edit: January 03, 2009, 07:24:57 AM by KJ_Lesnick
Back to business.

I have a couple of questions...

1.)  Is it possible to shorten the duct a bit to get it all to fit under the chine and meet all the requirements the VFX had to meet?

2.)  I'm wondering if the rear section of the lifting surface (the twin-booms on the F-15) should be thinner like how the rear section of the F-16 (the part where the speed-brakes are mounted)?  It seems a bit too wide or "fat" with the pancake.


KJ Lesnick



That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.

KJ_Lesnick

#215
January 05, 2009, 09:38:10 AM
Does anybody have any idea as to how much all of this would weigh?  I am trying to go with this whole fixed wing design largely for the purpose of being lighter than the F-14.


KJ Lesnick
That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.

KJ_Lesnick

#216
January 07, 2009, 05:52:16 PM
Okay,

I was thinking of the types of candidate wing-designs for the plane.  The basic shape I already have in mind depicted here:



Based on the F-15U which was a modified F-15 proposal with an enlarged, thickened, clipped delta-wing with a 50-degree leading-edge sweepback. 

There were already some variations I had in mind pertaining to thickness (I wanted to use a lower thickness similar to that of the F-15A/C/E to facilitate better high-speed drag), the use of leading-edge devices and multiple-position flaps for varying wing-camber in flight during cruise speed in addition to improving low-speed performance.


There are some variations which generally pertain to the trailing-edge configuration which I'm wondering if anyone here would have any good advice as to which would work best and such.


The first basic variations involve changing the outboard trailing-edge sweep to zero-degrees as shown here



The wing-design appeals to me as it strikes me as simpler and has been proven successful on the English-Electric Lightning.  I depicted two drawings (as you can see I'm a remarkably skilled artist :rolleyes: ) with variations being related to how large the "notched-out" area on the trailing-edge is.


The second-basic variation is based on a Lockheed-UAV design here...



here...


and here...


The wing-design depicted here seems to better blend the inboard trailing-edge sweep with the outboard trailing-edge sweep.


As I've said before, ideally I would prefer to employ strakes on the design much like Chinese Artist "Lego"'s fighter-drawing depicted here in regards to the leading-edge extentions...




Advice would be appreciated


KJ Lesnick


That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.

overscan

#217
January 11, 2009, 11:43:37 PM
I don't see any reason why an Su-27 style intake under a LERX would limit speed over the F-15 intake design.

Regarding the wing shapes, the second is unnecessarily complex for no obvious aerodynamic benefit I can see.
Paul Martell-Mead / Overscan
"What if?" addict

KJ_Lesnick

#218
January 13, 2009, 12:06:19 AM Last Edit: January 14, 2009, 08:50:03 AM by KJ_Lesnick
Overscan,

QuoteI don't see any reason why an Su-27 style intake under a LERX would limit speed over the F-15 intake design.

If so, then I don't see any problem with using the LERX.

QuoteRegarding the wing shapes, the second is unnecessarily complex for no obvious aerodynamic benefit I can see.

That's actually quite good to hear as the wing depicted on the UAV and such is remarkably difficult to draw right (proportions and everything).  I personally am more fond of the EE-Lightning style wing.


KJ Lesnick
That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.

KJ_Lesnick

#219
January 15, 2009, 05:24:45 PM Last Edit: January 16, 2009, 09:33:46 AM by KJ_Lesnick
I'm thinking the basic external inlet shape should be derived more from the MiG-29 and F-14 than the F-15. 

For the F-14's pancake to work efficiently with AIM-54's under it (with or without pallets) -- is it required that the inlet ducts be canted outward or that the front of the pancake (where the intakes are) be wider than the rear part of the pancake (where the engine nozzles are)?


KJ Lesnick
That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.

KJ_Lesnick

#220
January 17, 2009, 09:55:42 PM
Which inlet set-up would work better in terms of high mach, and/or high-alpha capability?
-A square-box like inlet a'la the MiG-29/F-14/Su-27.
-A rounded/oval inlet (F-111-ish shape, possibly taller than wide with a half-cone and such) or something.

Reasonably speaking, I could use opinions or advice


KJ Lesnick
That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.

Taiidantomcat

#221
January 19, 2009, 05:18:36 PM
I think there is a good reason the fighters you just mentioned all use boxy intakes and the F-111 uses the rounded. If you are going with fighters Boxy seems the way to go.
"Imagination is the one weapon in the war against reality." -Jules de Gaultier

"My model is right! It's the real world that's wrong!" -global warming scientist

An armor guy, who builds airplanes almost exclusively, that he converts to space fighters-- all while admiring ship models.

KJ_Lesnick

#222
January 20, 2009, 11:00:16 AM Last Edit: January 20, 2009, 11:16:08 AM by KJ_Lesnick
Taiidantomcat,

QuoteI think there is a good reason the fighters you just mentioned all use boxy intakes and the F-111 uses the rounded. If you are going with fighters Boxy seems the way to go.

Perhaps you're right...  Regardless, a 2D inlet is easier to design in any case (especially when variable geometry is concerned). 


KJ Lesnick
That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.

KJ_Lesnick

#223
January 21, 2009, 02:04:17 PM Last Edit: January 21, 2009, 02:07:52 PM by KJ_Lesnick
Regarding the shape of the back of the pancake, I'm wondering if a shape something like that depicted in the image below would be a useful aerodynamic shape for reducing drag and such...




KJ Lesnick
BTW: I should note that while the image has a lot of stuff edited out, I did not edit out any data related to copyrighting... the original image had no copryright on it... It however had a LOAD of text and all sorts of other stuff including two other images.  If the moderator wishes to see the original picture for verification, please ask and I will post it.
That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.

KJ_Lesnick

#224
January 22, 2009, 07:26:54 PM
Honestly,

The original target goals I originally started out are so much different than what I'm now thinking about, I'm thinking it probably would be better to start a new thread.

Anyone agree with me?
That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.
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