Grumman TBF and General Motors TBM Avenger

[nev]

Don't know why, but I think an Avenger in Israeli markings would look just right

[Jeffry Fontaine]

Since the original mission of the Avenger was hauling bombs and torpedos to attack ships and ground targets and later it was modified to perform other missions such as COD, ASW, and AEW.  What would an Avenger look like as an EW/ECM aircraft?  What would it have looked like if it had been modified and equipped to perform the electronic warfare mission during WWII and the Korean war?  Would the Avenger have had additional bulges/bumps similar to the Privateer or would it look like a porcupine with numerous blade antennas on the wings and fuselage like the Mosquito NF?  Appreciate any thoughts you might have on the subject.

[Sentinel Chicken]

It's a bit later on the timescale than what you specified, but the EA-1F Skyraider might offer some inspiration:



Windowless aft cockpit to house the ECM operators and all the associated ECM equipment in wing pods plus a few bumps and warts on the airframe.  

[elmayerle]

Well, let's speculate then.  Replace the aft turret with a fairing, possibly a radio-transparent one, and replace the weapons bay doors with panels carrying various "lumps and bumps" to suit the new mission.  For a more extreme effort, perhaps re-engining with a more powerful engine like the R3350?

Just the first thoughts off the top of my head.

[Leigh]

A big piece of luggage hanging from the underside like the ASW Gannet?
And everyone knows that electronics work better if the plane is painted pink.

[elmayerle]

Perhaps a "piece of baggage" like the radome the EP-3 is fitted with, but smaller?

[Howard of Effingham]

modeldecal sheet #18 includes decals for a FAA avenger ECM6 from the 1950's
and some suggestions about how to go about the conversion.

PM me with a snail mail address if you would like a photocopy of the instructions.

[Jeffry Fontaine]

Thanks to all that have provided input.  The AEW version is a bit too extreme on the extra baggage perhaps something a bit more subtle as this aircraft would be accompanying the strike aircraft to the target as an active jammer of communications and radars.  Most of the informaiton I have gleaned from my reference books point towards dedicated jammer aircraft that were converted from B-17 and B-24 bombers that flew in Europe during WWII.  Due to the size of the equipment that was mounted in the bomb bay.  The actual antenna for the jammer transmissions was not very large, just a blade antenna or two on the fuselage in close proximity to the equipment mounted inside.  With some improvements, similar equipment could have been mounted in the Avenger to perform a similar mission to support strike operations in the Pacific theater or Korea.  The Skyraider assumed that mission for the Navy and the Skynight for the Marines.  Both of these were replaced eventually by the EA-6A and EA-6B.   

[Captain Canada]

Belcher Bits do a nice conversion for the Avenger, with the longer greenhouse and some other bits. Might be a good starting point ?

http://belcherbits.mondenet.com/48sets.html

[datguy]

According to Magna Models, here's how the Fleet Air Arm handled it:

[Captain Canada]

That Magna conversion looks pretty good as well, and it's the right scale ! Although Belcher Bits is still promising to downsize his conversion set....

Another note on that Magna set, I think an H2S type radome like the Lanc would look better than just a tub like that. Although i suppose it's retractable.

And the BB Leigh Light looks like it would be a neat item to add to an a/c.

 

[Jeffry Fontaine]

Leigh Light to actively jam the eyes of the FLAK gunners?  Not quite what I had in mind but it might work...
The Magna ECM6 conversion looks like it could be retractable, as it is mounted in the bomb bay. All of this comes as a real surprise to me since I had assumed (yes, I know assume) that the first actual dedicated EW/ECM platform was based on the AD-5/A-1E/F/G Skyraider for the USN.  The RN version is very interesting and I wonder if there was any collaboration between the USN and the RN on that aircraft.   

[Jschmus]

I found this site, with a little information:

Uboat.net Avenger

They had this to say about a wartime radar variant:

The TBF-1D was a modification of the TBF-1 fitting the ASD or ASB radar for locating surfaced submarines or surface ships.

and this further mention:

There were at least 15 variants of the TBM-3, including many modified to carry various types of surface search radar or airborne early warning radar.

(the italics are mine; how they could say something like that and not go into more detail is beyond me)

Wait, on another site I found the following:

Post War Variants
TBM-3M: conversions for missile launching

TBM-3M2: updates with extra equipment

TBM-3N: conversions (1945/46) for special night attack missions

TBM-3Q: various rebuilds for post-war ECM and EW research and combat duty with prominent additions on belly, cockpit, fin and in some cases wings for reception and/or jamming

TBM-3R: conversions for seven passenger or cargo transport in at least three configurations, all without guns and with door on right

TBM-3S: major post-war conversion program for ASW strike, most being further updated as TBM-3S2 with TBM 3E2 avionics

TBM-3W: major post-war conversion program for AEW (radar picket) duty with APS-20 radar, no armament and extra fins; most updated as TBM-3W2 with upgraded displays for two rear operators and other changes

[Jeffry Fontaine]

TBM-3Q: various rebuilds for post-war ECM and EW research and combat duty with prominent additions on belly, cockpit, fin and in some cases wings for reception and/or jamming

Jason,

Thanks for the additional information.  That particular sub-variant of the Avenger was unknown to me until now.  Nice to see such quick response to my query and a lot of good information too.

[datguy]

Here's another idea - Grumman experimented with a fighter version of the TBF without the greenhouse canopy, called the FTBF.  It used a rather ugly fairing that isn't even as "elegant" as the canopy fairing on the TBM-3W.

What about substituting a bubble canopy for the pilot on a TBF/TBM, decking over the after fuselage, sealing the bomb-bay, and adding side doors for the ECM/ESM operators like was done in the AD-4 and AD-5 EWf aircraft?  

Jennings did a profile a while back with a true bubble canopy F6F.  A bubbletop TBM could be a sister ship.

DG