Alvis Salamander, Stalwart, Saracen, and Saladin series of 6X6 wheeled vehicles

[Mossie]

The Airfix OO NATO Groundcrew set has three armed figures in NBC suits & carrying SLR's, that's all I know of.  I did spot some 1/35 figures in resin at Telford, but not suprisingly they were expensive.

[Weaver]

The thing is, the kit companies must, logically, have tooling lying around for obsolete "Modern" infantry sets dating back to the 60s or 70s, so why not re-pop them as "Cold War Era" infantry?

[Mossie]

It's a definate possibility, Airfix's figures come around regularly, especially the better ones like the NATO ground crew.  The only possible trouble is that re-popping figure sets means that they'll of course be old moulds & not up to todays standards.  Manufacturer's do it all the time, but dodgy old moulds tend to really stand out when it comes to figures.  Saying that, I'm sure there'll be a few 'oldies but goodies' around.

[PR19_Kit]

Perhaps slightly off the thread but.......

In the late 60s I worked in the motor industry and did some work with Alvis on the early Stalwarts. They wanted some strain gauge readings taken from the rearmost drive shafts during the water-to-land transition and we did some tests at MIRA with a couple of them. It was all pretty straightforward stuff, bar trying not to get soaked to the skin checking out the wiring after the test runs, but the best fun was on the MIRA Open Day.......

The Stalwart being what it was, a darn great floating box with six wheels underneath and a cab on the front, it was the ideal vehicle to give rides around the Cross Country Circuit for the Press. This track was pretty 'robust' and they were all bounced around in the back quite nicely by the time we got to the water splash.....

Perhaps they missed the bit in the briefing where we said 'There will be a substantial wave coming over the front when we reach the water splash, so make sure you wear your capes'. Of course none of them did and they de-boarded looking like drowned rats. 

[Weaver]

Here's a mad idea:

1. Take two Saracens and place them one behind the other.

2. Cut the back 1/3rd off the front one, and graft it's rear panel into the hole.

3. cut the front 1/3rd off the back one and make up a new blanking plate for the front of it. Mount BOTH gun rings on the roof.

4. Join the two halves together with a powered, articulated linkage to make a wheeled version of those Volvo two-body Bv.206 snow-mobiles....

5. Use the left over bits to extend a Saladin to 8x8, with a rear-facing radio-operator/driver behind the turret. The original 40mm-armed concept had just such a fourth crewman, but he was dropped to make more room for ammo when the 76mm was adopted. They also studied 8x8 layouts based on the German WWII armoured cars.

[Mossie]

Do it Weave!

Do it Weave!

While trying to find a pic of the Challenger Marskman for the Chieftain/Chally thread, I came across a pic of a Saracen with what looked like a 76mm gun on a slightly larger turret, but can I find the b****r now???

Finally found that upgunned Saracen!  I know nothing about it though, just found it on this Korean site.  It has larger turret of a similar shape to the original & the MG is retained.  Apart from that, it appears to be a common or garden Saracen.





Found it on this Korean language site, so if anyone can read it (my computer doesn't recognise the text, not that it'd make a blind bit of difference) please let us know what it says!
http://kr.blog.yahoo.com/sturmgechutz/folder/41.html

[Weaver]

Egad - nice find Mossie, but I'm not sure what to make of it. The gun looks way to big for the Saracen turret ring: could it be a training vehicle perhaps, with a dummy gun and a built-up turret to "play the bad guy" in exercises?

The engine bay looks like it's been extended forwards too - diesel conversion?

[Mike Wren]

looks like a mock up, the main gun looks fixed directly to the turret front & doesn't seem to be able to elevate, maybe it's a film prop?

[Mossie]

I wondered about that, I zoomed in on the pic & it looks like the very small mantlet does have some limited pitch available.  It's hard to tell, but if it does, it's not a lot.  The turret pattern for the Saracen seems to have been pretty closely followed so I would err on the side of mock-up rather than film prop?

[Mossie]

Now that is crazy.  Cool  , but crazy  !

[Weaver]

Here's a mad idea:...

Weaver,

You mean kind of like this?

Yep - you got it!  Nicely done....

The only thing I'd do different is have the two open gun rails on the rear body instead of a second turret: gives the infantry maximum opportunity to use their own weapons: MILANs, Charlie Gs, GPMGs etc., and that's just Brits!

[Weaver]

The articulated Saracen would have to be called the Crossley Caterpillar, of course.....

[famvburg]

Since I was a little kid in the late '60s - early '70s, one of my fav vehicles was the above. I know its chassis was used for the Saracen APC, Salamnder Airfield Fire Tender & the Stalwart tractor, the coolest of them all, IMHO. I loved that the thing since my Matchbox Cars days! Any thoughts?

[Weaver]

You could seriously up-gun it: just look at the range of weapons fitted to significantly lighter French armoured cars.

[dy031101]

I think it definitely has the potential for a Cockerill Mk.3 90mm gun?