RASPBERRY RIPPLE

[NARSES2]

I have a project in mind but need to know when Raspberry Ripple was first used by the RAE ? Sure you lot can help.

[PR19_Kit]

There's a semi-usesfull thread on ARC...

http://www.arcforums.com/forums/air/index.php?showtopic=135927&st=0

...but with NO dates at all

They mention various types using the scheme, going back as far as the Hastings, Varsity and even a Beverley!

When I was doing my HND at Cranfield in the mid '60s they had a BAC 1-11 in there destined for the Blind Flying Unit at Bedford, and the College got the contract to repaint it in the Yelllow-White-Red scheme used at Bedford. I'm pretty sure it arrived painted Raspberry Ripple, as they were thinking of leaving some of the red and white in place, but eventually stripped it right down.

I have the official drawing for the BFU scheme squirrelled away somewhere.....

[Mossie]

Difficult one Chris.  Depends exactly what you mean by Rasberry Ripple too. I had a look in my Farnborugh 100 book, but it wasn't much use.  I then had a dig through Airliners.net.  If you mean the Red White Blue scheme that came to be known as Rasberry Ripple, then the earliest photo I can find is of a RAE Hunter from 1976.  I'm guessing this is what you mean when you specify RAE.
http://www.airliners.net/photo/UK%20-%20Air%20Force/Hawker%20Hunter%20T7/1207320/L/&width=1024&height=690&sok=keyword_(%27+%22Royal%22_+%22Aircraft%22_+%22Establishment%22%27_IN_BOOLEAN_MODE))_&sort=_order_by_year_&photo_nr=11&prev_id=0979144&next_id=1218863

A&AEE used an earlier version of white over grey with a red cheatline, the earliest photo I can find is of a Beverley from 1971 (great anecdote with that pic!):
http://www.airliners.net/photo/UK%20-%20Air%20Force/Blackburn%20Beverley%20C.1/1251720/L/&width=1024&height=678&sok=keyword_(%27+%22A&sort=_order_by_year_&photo_nr=3&prev_id=1233826&next_id=1273640

There was a Hunter of the Institute of Aviation Medicine (according to the Farnborough 100 book), white with red cheatline, tail & wingtips, which *I thought* coined the Rasberry Ripple nickname.  Going on what kit says though, there was an earlier version?  The Air Britain archives might yield something, but it's bed time so I'll have a look at work if I get a chance.

[PR19_Kit]

A&AEE used an earlier version of white over grey with a red cheatline, the earliest photo I can find is of a Beverley from 1971 (great anecdote with that pic!):

Hehehe '....those are our fins' indeed!

I spent some hours in the cargo bay of various Bevs in the late 50s, in my CCF uniform when I should have been at school games, but flying was MUCH more fun, and educational too of course.

To airdop cargo the rear doors of the Bev had to be physically removed and left behind at the airfield, leaving an 8 ft square hole in the back. Looking out of there you were always aware of the two fins in the corners of your vision, until the paras dropped out of the huge hatch in the bottom of the boom about 15 ft in front of your amazed eyes!

Back to RAE colours, the book that ought to anwer it is mentioned in the ARC link, called 'Testing Colours' by Adrian Balch. Some second-hand ones still available on Amazon, but avoid the ones from Florida which START at over £55! Ridiculous........ 

[NARSES2]

Thanks Gents - my project will be circa mid 60's, so I might have to stretch things a bit

As for Beverly's a mate of mine used to jump out of that boom on them - frightening thought !

[PR19_Kit]

As for Beverly's a mate of mine used to jump out of that boom on them - frightening thought !

Respect for him!

I sat up there and watched them go a few times, they lined up in two rows with the static lines hooked up, the jumpmaster opened the two HUGE doors in the floor at the back and they all just walked off and out of the hole! I think they went alternate sides, but the hatch was big enough for two paras to go out side by side. They had a big red safety bar that fitted across the rear of the boom to stop people walking through the hole when the aircraft was on the ground with the hatch open. It was a LONG way down.

A couple of times the loadmaster let me sling out the drogue chute when dropping a Landie and trailer. The drogue was about 18" in dia. and you just literally lobbed it out the back door! It then whizzed off astern, dragged out a much bigger drogue which in turn dragged out the mains that were attached to the load. There was a loud rumbling sound and the whole shebang shot out of the rear hole at a rate of knots as the Captain tried to keep the Bev in trim.

Ah nostalgia, not what it used to be.......

[Sorry for the radical thread drift here]

[Mossie]

Chris, in the mid to late sixties the RAE used a standard scheme that predated Rasberry Ripple.  It was white uppers & grey lowers (possibly MSG) with a blue cheatline, sometimes other parts of the aircraft were blue but this differed between types.  It was very similar to the A&AEE scheme that used a red cheatline instead.  It tended to be the preserve of larger aircraft, such as Shacks, Hastings & the like.
Shackleton
Varsity
BAC 111

Devons (or maybe Herons, I'll dig the Farnborough book out again when I get home) wore a different scheme, all over blue with a yellow cheatline ountlined in white.

Fighters & such of this period wore highly individual colours, usually quite bright & dynamic but clearly not military schemes apart from roundels & fin flash.  Some of the pics are A&AEE aircraft, but the same rule seemed to apply, although those aircraft tend to have clear demarcations, possibly for calibration purpose.  You could have fun creating your own scheme.
Hunter
Sea Vixen
Javelin

[Mossie]

Kit, I'm fortunate to live only a mile or so away from the last Beverley at Fort Paull.  There's a thread some pics I took just over two years ago.  I've got to admit I've neglected the girl, even though I live so close I've only visited her 'properly' the once, but I sometimes walk down the riverside & if I do I make sure I take a route where I can see her.  She may not be the prettiest girl, but I love her!
http://www.whatifmodelers.com/index.php/topic,11701.0/highlight,blackburn+beverley.html

I'd really like to get hold of the Magna kit & do it up as the car ferry version that never made it, maybe in Silver City colours.  It'll probably be after I remortgage the house though!

[PR19_Kit]

Mossie,

I'd really like to get hold of the Magna kit & do it up as the car ferry version that never made it, maybe in Silver City colours.  It'll probably be after I remortgage the house though!

This is going to end up WELL off topic now....... 

I'm green with envy for you living that close to '259. I used to drop in and see her whenever I was around the Beverley area when she was at the Museum of Army Transport. Bizarrely '259 was the first production Bev, and the last one to fly. She never was in squadron service and had the lowest hours of any Bev as a result, spending almost all her time at Boscombe Down. My Dad worked with her in the mid 50s (after his flying career was cut short) when they were developing the LAPES system to drop loads out the back at ultra low level but with no chutes, called ULLDs in those days.

In your pic of the interior of the boom you it looks like you must have been standing on the drop hatch when you took the pic, or very close to it anyway. I hope they had the safety bar installed!

As for modelling the Bev, you'll need a fork lift to do the Magna model, it weighs a TON! I've thought of doing the Welsh vacform as '259 when she was owned by Court Line. They bought her to carry RB211s around for the two Tri-Stars, but never painted her in Court colours. I'd aim to change all that of course

There was a documented proposal to build a Bev Mk II with Tynes and a much sleeker fuselage, and I have some drawings of it the definative Bev book by Bill Overton, but like much of my library I can't get to it just now.

One day I'll write up about flying to Gibraltar in a 47 Sqdn Bev............ by mistake! 

[Weaver]

Kit: even further off topic, when we had the RJ at Woodford, they used to use similar safety bars on the doors when there wasn't a stair/scaffold outside. One day, a fitter leant on the bar and him and the bar took a nose-dive straight out onto the factory floor from about 15 feet, resulting in him being very badly hurt (permantently crippled, IIRC). Turned out that some genius had put the bar in place, but not put the locking pins in the ends.....

Mossie: there's a cutaway of the Beverly car ferry in the very excellent Eagle Annual of the Cutaways book:

http://www.orionbooks.co.uk/HB-43293/the-eagle-annual-of-the-cutaways.htm

Even if you're not serious about the car ferry, you still want this book - trust me on this.....

[NARSES2]

Thanks for those Mossie, given me some ideas.

As for off topic - I love 'em - maybe we should start a "Kit's bedtime stories" thread 

[PR19_Kit]

As for off topic - I love 'em - maybe we should start a "Kit's bedtime stories" thread 

Oh gawd, the spoils of a mis-spent youth and a mad crazy life.................. 

[Mossie]

In your pic of the interior of the boom you it looks like you must have been standing on the drop hatch when you took the pic, or very close to it anyway. I hope they had the safety bar installed!

As for modelling the Bev, you'll need a fork lift to do the Magna model, it weighs a TON! I've thought of doing the Welsh vacform as '259 when she was owned by Court Line. They bought her to carry RB211s around for the two Tri-Stars, but never painted her in Court colours. I'd aim to change all that of course

There was a documented proposal to build a Bev Mk II with Tynes and a much sleeker fuselage, and I have some drawings of it the definative Bev book by Bill Overton, but like much of my library I can't get to it just now.

Yeah, there's a barrier of some sort in place, can't quite remember, but there's a clear perspex panel over the hatch so you can see down.  That's far enough for me, wouldn't catch me jumping out of it with a giant hanky strapped to my back!  I'll probably take a trip to Fort Paull soon & get some more detailed pics, I'll share them here if I do.

I've heard that the Magna kit has a solid resin wing & that some beefy braces are needed, I may get one some time!  Now if someone brought out an injection kit I'd snap their hand off, but I can't see it happening, mores the pity.

I'd love to see those Bev Mk.II drawings if you ever get a chance to dig them out.

Mossie: there's a cutaway of the Beverly car ferry in the very excellent Eagle Annual of the Cutaways book:

Got it for Christmas Weave, fantastic isn't it!   I'd be fairly serious about the Beverley if wasn't for the cost of the Magna kit & vacforms give me the willies!

Thanks for those Mossie, given me some ideas.

As for off topic - I love 'em - maybe we should start a "Kit's bedtime stories" thread 

No probs Chris, looking forward to seeing whatever you've got planned!  Yeah I'd like to hear some of those tales too, maybe we should start a thread were people can share any stories or reminisces they've got.

[PR19_Kit]

I'll write up my 'Beverley Tales' and post them in 'Everyday Chat' later tonight, if that's allowed?

[Mossie]

Devons (or maybe Herons, I'll dig the Farnborough book out again when I get home) wore a different scheme, all over blue with a yellow cheatline outlined in white.

Found one on the Air-Britain archive, there were four Devon C.1's, all painted largely blue with yellow stripe & white trim, white fuselage tops with yellow trim & writing
http://www.abpic.co.uk/popup.php?q=1000663

I've found a smaller aircraft in the blue/white/grey, a Meteor T.7:
http://www.abpic.co.uk/popup.php?q=1026548

Another A&AEE aircraft individual scheme, the well known Bucc XW988 in yellow, green & white (maybe pale grey) undersides.
http://www.abpic.co.uk/popup.php?q=1087483

One more option that fits your timeframe is to use a standard scheme, but paint the nose, tail & wingtips red.  Basically, it's the red portions from raspberry ripple scheme.  A slightly earlier version used day-glo orange instead of the red (it coinsides with RAF & RN aircraft ditching day-glo, as it rapidly weathered) & would have been seen in your time frame on slightly older aircraft such as the Shack. 
http://www.abpic.co.uk/popup.php?q=1022722s

Around the time raspberry ripple as we know & love it was introduced (mid seventies-ish), it seems the RAE had aircraft in just about every finish we've described here!  I guess this is why it was introduced, to standardise aircraft although there were still a few schemes hanging around by the mid eighties.