High speed recon bomber

[Logan Hartke]

I respectfully disagree with the suggestions about adding tailplanes or a fin: a lot of early jet concepts had tailless configurations, in fact if I had to write a backstory for your's, I'd be inclined to make it a Shorts design.

I was getting a Barnes Wallis "Swallow" vibe from it when I was putting the wings on. I was briefly tempted to put the engines on the wing tips, but...nah. that would just be too much. I was also tempted to go with a Raspberry Ripple paint scheme, but without a tail it would have been tough.

This looks great.  I say Martin or Handley Page.  That tailless design fits very well with their concepts such as the Manx and most of the early designs for what would later become the Victor.  They even later trialled that same engine arrangement with the HP.115.

Cheers,

Logan

[Brian da Basher]

Double-dog dare ya to put piston engines and props on that B-47 Frank!

Brian da Basher

I'll meet you half way, Brian - turboprops!

Frank

Now that takes it to the next level!

I can't wait to see it!

Bruan da Basher

[frank2056]

It doesn't look like I've done much on this today, but I have (besides PSR):



I added the nose cone (filled with Klean Klay and lead pellets, just in case this turns out to be a tail sitter), started work on the cockpit (I even found two 1/144 scale pilots) and tacked on two J47s from the 1/144 B-47 kit. I also filled in the upper turret hole with my favorite homemade putty - CA + talc. The upper engines are a bit too far back; they should be 3-4 mm forward.



This shows the approximate position of the forward engines. I can't move them back much - they'll affect the main landing gear doors. The bays were cut out from the DML 1/200 scale B-52 and glued into the fuselage. I cut the fuselage to match the gear doors. The gear position is a little funky, with one gear forward of the other. I also opened up what will be the rear camera ports. Not visible in any of these pics is the rear weapons system area, which right now is just the kit's rear gunner canopy glued in place with a big dollop of CA + talc, then sanded smooth.

This kit has surprisingly good fit as well as engraved panel lines. Next time Squadron has them for $2, I may get one to build as a B-26 some day.

Logan - thanks for the "precursor" suggestions. I think I have to make the vertical fins more "British"; right now they look like a mixture of German WWII and US design esthetics.



Frank

[Cobra]

Sweet Job have you come up with a Name Yet? be glad to give a Few if you want them. Keep up the great Work!!!!!!!!

[frank2056]

Sweet Job have you come up with a Name Yet? be glad to give a Few if you want them. Keep up the great Work!!!!!!!!

I always have a hard time picking names for projects. So as long as it sounds like a proper British name for a recon bomber, then go ahead!

[Cobra]

how about a Name from 'Crimson Skies' Balmoral. that Work for You??

[Logan Hartke]

No problem, Frank.  It looks so good.

I always have a hard time picking names for projects. So as long as it sounds like a proper British name for a recon bomber, then go ahead!

How about the "Handley Page Hermes" for a fast recon aircraft?

Cheers,

Logan

[Stargazer]

Need I remind you why the US Navy rechristened the E-6A Hermes into the E-6A Mercury?? 

(Handley Page Hermes sounds great nevertheless.  )

[Brian da Basher]

I really like the addition of the B-47 jets, Frank! I don't know if you're set on the engine placement, but here's a thought: how about going with an "over and under" engine arrangement by placing the engines from the tail on top of the wing above the other ones? I'd think that would emphasize the "tail-less" feature as well as make it look very sleek and streamlined. Also, there's a bit of a precident to this as there was a British prototype with a similar engine layout.

No matter what direction you take this in, I can only be amazed by your creative vision!

Brian da Basher

[Tophe]

Wow!

[Sauragnmon]

Not sure the under-wing fit looks right really... but if you PSR'ed it enough to blend with the fuse and the wing, it might not be so bad.  Badger-esque Root mounting might be a smoother approach in concept.

[Weaver]

I really like the addition of the B-47 jets, Frank! I don't know if you're set on the engine placement, but here's a thought: how about going with an "over and under" engine arrangement by placing the engines from the tail on top of the wing above the other ones? I'd think that would emphasize the "tail-less" feature as well as make it look very sleek and streamlined. Also, there's a bit of a precident to this as there was a British prototype with a similar engine layout.

No matter what direction you take this in, I can only be amazed by your creative vision!

Brian da Basher

The British prototype with over-and-under engines was the Shorts Sperrin: a "conservative" straight-wing submission the requirement that led to the V-bombers. It was too conservative in the end, but the prototypes did useful research. Shorts developed the design into the S.B.1, which was the design I was thinking of when I said Frank's design looks like a Shorts job. The S.B.1 was tailless, with a Geoff Hill aeroisoclinic swept wing with all-moving tips (actually the outer third of the wing). Over-and-under engines pairs sat on the trailing edge just outboard from the roots, and a fifth engine was buried in the rear fusealge, fed by a dorsal intake. The nose was very like the Sperrin. It seems to have been rejected primarily because of the workload involved in doing the basic research for using aeroisoclinic wings for a fast, heavy aircraft.

[batmancustoms]

Digging this!

[Daryl J.]

More!



Daryl J.

[frank2056]

Most of the work I did on this model this weekend was on the wings. I removed the vertical fins to make the wings easier to work with. After removing the B-26 wing fuselage mount points (they were too thick and too short) I was left with two large holes in the fuselage. I filled the holes with surf board foam, then hardened it with CA; it soaks into the foam easily and makes a rigid and smooth structure.
The wing roots from the EF-128 were flat, so there was a huge gap between the wings and the fuselage. I reduced this gap by wrapping some coarse sandpaper (60 or 80 grit) around the fuselage and sanding the wing root into a mating curve:



This is the result. I sanded them some more after this picture and the fit is even better. I ended up needing only a tiny amount of putty to fill the gap on top and none underneath:



I also pinned the wings to strengthen and align the wing-fuselage joint:



I had to mark the wings with port and starboard to keep from mixing them up - even then, I mixed them up!  The glue & putty are now drying and I'll wipe off the excess with denatured alcohol tonight; it should be a smooth transition.

I also filled the rear elevator section with CA + talc and sanded the area down, but no pictures yet.

Brian, I moved the engines to close to the wing shoulder and they look pretty good; I also found some 1/100 scale Jumo 004 from a Tamiya kit that may work as well. The 707 engines are too big, the B-52 engines too small; these seem just about right. I may also loose the lower B-47 engines; they're just hanging too close to the ground.

Mounting the engines at the wing root a la Tu-16 would have been great (and I tried some layouts) but it would have required more engineering than I was willing to put into this project. It would have tipped it from "fun" to "a chore" pretty quickly.


Frank