Amphibious Assault Ships: Tarawa, Iwo Jima, etc., etc.

[seadude]

A thought just occured to me. Instead of decommissioning some of our oldest amphib assault ships (Tarawa's, Iwo Jima, etc., etc.) and using them for Sinkex's or letting them sit in mothballs, etc., Why don't we try selling them and/or refurbishing them into civilian operated humanitarian relief ships or hospital ships? With the amount of disasters that happen all over the world, I tend to think this might be a good idea.
Any other thoughts or conversions?

[Cliffy B]

The problem with using them as civilian operated ships is the cost of operation and the manning levels.  I know they'd be converted and what not but they still are LARGE ships using old and complicated steam plants (complicated compared to modern gas turbines) which take a lot of skilled people to operate.  The civilian world runs mostly on marine diesels IE no steam plant experience anymore.  I'm not saying you couldn't learn how to do it but all that it translates into is more money you'd have to spend.  I'm not sure any civy organizations have the capital/manpower to run such a ship.

One idea that could work is to turn them over to USNS and convert them to Hospital ships.  They have the manpower and capital to be able to make use of such large ships.  Only problem is to effective convert them to hospital ships would require a lengthy re-build/gutting of the ship.  How many useful service years do the old LHAs have left?  That's the kicker.  A lot of times these seemingly "modern" ships are used for SINKEXs is because they've been run into the ground and/or are too big/costly for anyone else to operate, hence the only alternative left is to sink them and try to at least learn something about their survivability and use that to build better ships.

An AH conversion of an LHA could/would be cool.  Paint 'em all white with some big honking red crosses on em    They could even retain their hangars and part if not all of their flight decks and carry a massive amount of medevac helos adorned in a similar paint job.  Hmmmm....me likey!

Just my $0.02 on the matter.

[seadude]

An AH conversion of an LHA could/would be cool.  Paint 'em all white with some big honking red crosses on em.  They could even retain their hangars and part if not all of their flight decks and carry a massive amount of medevac helos adorned in a similar paint job.  Hmmmm....me likey!

I already have that in mind.  Might start one next year as I have a 1/700 Nassau.

What about converting some of the amphibs into small CV's? Today's modern CVN's are getting way too costly to man and operate. Granted, you can't fly F-18's off a amphib ship, but there's enough flight deck space for F-35's. Switching to smaller CV's would be more practical and economical.

[Ed S]

What about converting some of the amphibs into small CV's? Today's modern CVN's are getting way too costly to man and operate. Granted, you can't fly F-18's off a amphib ship, but there's enough flight deck space for F-35's. Switching to smaller CV's would be more practical and economical.

Sounds kind of like what Adm Zumwalt tried to do back in the 80's with his "Sea Control" ship ideas.  But once he left office, the rest of the "big carrier" Navy brass pretty much canned his ideas.

Ed

[Jschmus]

A couple of months back, Sentinel Chicken posted top views of two different carrier designs for the Tarawa hull.  One was a CVS-type carrying an airgroup of S-3s and helos, and the other was a CVA-type (think Essex) with added F/A-18s.  I'll see if I can locate the thread.

Aha!  Found it:

http://www.whatifmodelers.com/index.php/topic,15161.30.html

[Joe C-P]

The LHAs are worn and would not have many years left even if overhauled. And the LHDs would require too big a crew and too much money to convert.

What would work are LSDs or LPDs, with the well deck closed up and converted to medical facilities. The area for troops becomes housing for medical personnel, and the flight deck and vehicle ramps allow transport of patients whether docked or anchored.

As for the LHDs, the USN might be able to sell one to a country like Argentina as a helo carrier, with the promise of F-35Bs. Perhaps India could be convinced, too, to finally give up on the former Gorshkov, which seems to be nothing more than a constant source of income for Russia.

[Cobra]

what about Turning them into  Air Sea Rescue Carriers for the USCG? think that would work? just something i had hanging around in my Mind for a Bit! Stay Cool Dan

[Weaver]

Reminds me of an idea I had a few years ago for civilian disaster relief helicopter ships based on surplus container ships fitted (permanently) with Arapaho-style hangars and decks with containerised hospitals below. The civilian base ship avoids the problem of needing military skills to operate it, and many of the limitations of Arapaho wouldn't apply to purely civilian ops, i.e. it wouldn't have to defend itself. The ships would be home-ported at strategic points around the world and equipped with surplus helos that could be supported by local industry: for example, the one based at Capetown would have Pumas, the one at Galveston surplus Hueys from AMARC, etc...

[anthonyp]

what about Turning them into  Air Sea Rescue Carriers for the USCG? think that would work? just something i had hanging around in my Mind for a Bit! Stay Cool Dan

See the "US" Section of my Carrier Airwings subject, aka, The Manifesto.

[tinlail]

I have thought that the true solution to the littoral combat ship problem was PT-boats/FAC like the Super Dvora Mk III these boats have a shallow enough draft to allow operations out of a LHA well deck. The spaces for supporting marines would be well suiting for supporting maintenance for the boats, and keeping helicopters on the LHA would help mitigate the major short coming of FAC in providing some air support for the boats.

[Just call me Ray]

A couple of months back, Sentinel Chicken posted top views of two different carrier designs for the Tarawa hull.  One was a CVS-type carrying an airgroup of S-3s and helos, and the other was a CVA-type (think Essex) with added F/A-18s.  I'll see if I can locate the thread.

Aha!  Found it:

http://www.whatifmodelers.com/index.php/topic,15161.30.html

Hmmm, might as well post in here....


What about a new-build hull based on America along the same principle?

[pyro-manic]

Re-engining a large ship like that costs so much you might as well build a new one, and get exactly what you want rather than a compromise to fit in with the existing structure. You have to basically rip the entire ship apart to get at the engineering spaces, and then put it all back together again afterwards. That doesn't take into account the material condition of the hull, either. The Tarawas are all 30+ years old, the Iwo Jimas even older. They're likely to be in less than optimum condition.

[Joe C-P]

JoeP: did you mean that the LHA hulls are "gone" or the mechanicals? The MSC are used to 'old school' but, if the hulls have much life left, what about converting to diesel-electric and azipods?

The ships were "rode hard and put away wet". The amount of money, time, and effort needed to restore them to a useful condition with a reasonable lifetime would buy a new ship.
However, you could go back in time to the 1990s, with the USN having more LHDs built and selling the LHAs with some life left in them.

If you want a through-deck in good shape nowadays, you might talk to the Italians or Japanese.

[Thorvic]

For more general purpose ships how about the Dutch Enforcer deign series, the Dutch and Spanish Navies have full Landing ships and the UK replaced its LSL with a simplified Bay design, The Bay has small dock suitable for standard landing craft not LCAC, large flight deck, plenty of cargo space and accomodation. The RN used one of these for sending aid to Haiti.

Just thinking a Bay type design with a Hanger stucture would be ideal fo the coast gaurd for disater duties, command ship secondary landing ship ect

G