ZEro Length Launch (ZELL) Systems

[KJ_Lesnick]

How much stress does the ZELL put on an airframe compared to a carrier launch?

BTW:  Did the USN make a big deal about ZELL's (as an argument could be made about carriers being made obsolete)

[PR19_Kit]

BTW:  Did the USN make a big deal about ZELL's (as an argument could be made about carriers being made obsolete)

They'd still need to land them somewhere though.

[pyro-manic]

How much stress does the ZELL put on an airframe compared to a carrier launch?

I don't know, but I think it would depend on the rate of acceleration the rockets gave to the aircraft. As long as the rocket is powerful enough to lift the aircraft, it could actually accelerate it up to flying speed fairly slowly (more slowly than a catapult launch, anyway). Obviously a Nike Sprint booster wouldn't be a good idea. You could conceivably use rockets instead of catapults for carrier launching, but it'd be very wasteful and you'd need to have an awful lot of carrier volume given over to carrying engines and fuel (even if you can work out a way to re-use the engines).

[dy031101]

Other than the Thunderbird shows, is there other possible source of inspirations I can use in putting a ZELL system on a military ship?

[rallymodeller]

Other than the Thunderbird shows, is there other possible source of inspirations I can use in putting a ZELL system on a military ship?

Other than those already mentioned, can't think of any more. Stratos 4 is probably a better bet for reference than Thunderbirds; in the OVA (DVD-only release) they switch from TSR.2s to Foxhounds and there is a B-58/T-4 hybrid as well ("Stratos 4" itself). The trucks used for the TELs are MAZ-543s, and you can even get those in 1/48 (Arii FROG Launchers).

I actually have the entire series on DVD (including the extras and the OVA) and can get you as many screencaps as you want.

[rickshaw]

Other than the Thunderbird shows, is there other possible source of inspirations I can use in putting a ZELL system on a military ship?

Various USN & Soviet cruise missile systems, usually launched from submarines utilised such technology.  Regulus springs to mind as one.  Land systems include Mace and Matador, directly launching from hangars.

[Mossie]

Other than the Thunderbird shows, is there other possible source of inspirations I can use in putting a ZELL system on a military ship?

Boeing AN-1 submarine, carrying eight ZELL F11F Tigers, it could carry missiles instead.  You could intergrate a similar system into a surface warship.  More on Secret Projects:
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,2390.msg20024.html#msg20024

[rickshaw]

How did they land back on the carrier or were they single shot weapons?

[Rheged]

How did they land back on the carrier or were they single shot weapons?

I assumed that they were  to function like a CAM ship Hurricane.

[Mossie]

More background on the project on another Secret Projects thread including a mach 3 aircraft designed specifically for the job.
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,3979.0.html

How did they land back on the carrier or were they single shot weapons?

I assumed that they were  to function like a CAM ship Hurricane.

The thread mentions the dedicated Mach 3 aircraft would have been recovered onto a rig in a similar way to the Ryan X-13.  It seems the F11F's on the profile above were not intended for the AN-1, but the Grayback subs in place of the Regulus.  Some work was done to see if the Tigers would fit.

[Mossie]

Talking of the Tiger, here's proposed ZELL version of the two seat Super Tiger scanned from the Naval Fighters volume on the F11F-1F.  The book says it would have been suited to Zell because it could fit on the back of a trailer (the Super Tiger was compact compared to other 50's mach 2 fighters) & had a 70% stronger structure than century series aircraft due to it's naval origins.

[philp]

Another thread resurrection.

Just saw this kit from HAWK.



Did find that the F-84 was used in ZELL tests but it had the under fuselage rocket like the F-100 and F-104 tests, not under wing rockets like the kit.

Still...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=voixUMWvkV4

[Weaver]

Looks to me like the F-84 in the kit DOES have an underfuselage rocket: it's not very conspicuous because it's painted black.

[Sauragnmon]

All four of the items on the wings are fuel tanks.  The rocket is hidden by the launch rack, painted black, and it hangs down behind the truck as well.

On a different note, that might fit here... I had the mad scientist idea the other day of what if a MiG-21 was fitted with a ramjet engine instead of a normal jet?  Give it a rocket booster, and then see how fast you could get that sucker to go?

[Mossie]

The single engine versions of the Ye-150 series might be good for that, they look like MiG-21's only quite a bit bigger.