General-Dynamics/Grumman F-111B

[KJ_Lesnick]

What were the TFX requirements regarding

1.) The distance the aircraft had to loiter out in front of the carrier for the intended fleet air-defense mission?
2.) The required endurance the aircraft needed on station with the intended fleet air-defense load-out?

Also, what were the F-111B's actual capabilities in terms of endurance with the intended fleet air-defense mission?


KJ
Remember to read my sig below...

[rickshaw]

Remember to read my sig below...

You left out the word "who"... 

[famvburg]

     Or is it "whom"?

Remember to read my sig below...

You left out the word "who"... 

[KJ_Lesnick]

rickshaw and famvburg

That's not relevant to the questions I asked...

[rickshaw]

You said,

Remember to read my sig below..

I did and I pointed out the error in it.  Wasn't that fulfilling one of your requests?

[KJ_Lesnick]

Can you just answer the main question?

Assuming it's not classified, what were the TFX (F-111B) requirements regarding

1.) The distance the aircraft had to loiter out in front of the carrier for the intended fleet air-defense mission?
2.) The required endurance the aircraft needed on station with the intended fleet air-defense load-out?

Also, what were the F-111B's actual capabilities in terms of endurance with the intended fleet air-defense mission?

[rickshaw]

There is no need to be rude.

Have you attempted a google search?   I found it on my second attempt.  Try the terms, "f-111b endurance loiter time"  You might be surprised what you find!

[KJ_Lesnick]

It's loiter time was only 3.5 hrs @ 150 nm from the carrier?  I always thought it would be longer than that.

KJ

[rickshaw]

See what you can find if you make the effort?

[Old Wombat]

F-111 was never really designed with loiter time in mind; it's op's were largely to be a matter of "Get In - Get Out". Its engines gave it a pretty good range but they weren't really designed to be throttled back to allow low fuel usage & endurance.

[PR19_Kit]

Flight refuelling?

[KJ_Lesnick]

Old Wombat

F-111 was never really designed with loiter time in mind; it's op's were largely to be a matter of "Get In - Get Out".

While it's true that the aircraft was largely designed for a high-speed/low-altitude penetration run, as I understand it, the requirements to do this mean a relatively high fuel-load which is useful for endurance.  The variable-sweep wings (when swept forward) also are conducive for low-speed cruise-flight (high aspect-ratio) and the F-111B had a larger wingspan and wing-area than the F-111A.

Its engines gave it a pretty good range but they weren't really designed to be throttled back to allow low fuel usage & endurance.

As I understand it, the TF30's gave it good range because they had a low specific fuel consumption, particularly at low-speeds as they are turbofans move a larger amount of exhaust at a somewhat slower velocity than a turbojet.  High speed performance is do-able because their bypass ratio is not ridiculously high (1.5 to 1) and because of the use of afterburning.

[KJ_Lesnick]

rickshaw

See what you can find if you make the effort?

Doesn't sound like much endurance or range.  From what was written in Tommy Thomason's book on the XF8U-3, the aircraft (F8U-3) could loiter 200nm from the target for two hours, with the remaining hour spent dashing out to nail an incoming bomber or two from an abeam position, running down the remaining bomber if applicable; then cruising back to the carrier and landing.


KJ

[KJ_Lesnick]

I thought the whole idea of the Naval-TFX was that it was supposed to have a drastically improved endurance and range over the F4H/F-4?

[sandiego89]

I thought the whole idea of the Naval-TFX was that it was supposed to have a drastically improved endurance and range over the F4H/F-4?

But remember it was also designed to have a significant detection and shootdown range of long range bombers- much beyond the capabilty of F-4.  This requires a large radar dish, a huge avionics bay and large missiles.  This drove much of the size of the aircraft, with larger airframe, increased fuel etc.  It was designed to carry six long range missiles, which eventually turned out to be the Phoenix and these missiles are much larger than a sparrow.
For long ranger intercept a F-4 Phantom would carry 4 Sparrow missles with a total weight of missles of ~ 1800 pounds (plus AIM-9).  The F-111B would carry 6 missiles which totalled out at over 5,800 pounds, a heavier radar and missile control system and significantly more time on station capabilty.