Humbrol Clear problem help

[Spey_Phantom]

i have a problem 

last night, after i finished a model, i gave it a first layer of Humbrol clear to seal everything up.
as i wanted to give it a second layer this morning, i noticed that i had these white milky stains on some of the surfaces (on black and red parts)
i cant seem to get these out, any advice?

[PR19_Kit]

Chris (aka Narses2) had EXACTLY the same problem only a short while ago. He'll be on this afternoon I expect and he'll be able to give you chapter and verse on how he got round that.

I think it involved a coat of Klear on top of it, but please don't try that until Chris confirms it.

[Dizzyfugu]

If it's the Humbrol matt enamel varnish, you HAVE to stir it up well, esp. when it has been standing around for some time. Thinner and varnish separate after some time - you can see that when you have a glass bottle. An extra shot of thinner helps, too, but stirring is a must, as the varnish itself tends to "clump" - it's very stable in this state, and you easily strike it on a model when you use a brush. Happened to me once or twice, too - sometimes you can amke the white stains disappear with some strokes of a brush, just dipped in clean thinner, but there's ano guarantee. You might have to paint it over or stripe the paint and renew the area - or (like me  ), work creatively with the stains and modify them as weathering stains, if appropriate...

[NARSES2]

I had this problem with Humbrol SPRAY Matt Clear varnish. I painted it over with a coat of Klear/Future and that solved the problem.

If it's bottle enamel varnish then yes it really does need a lot of stirring. I now use an artists varnish from the bottle for small parts which doesn't need as much stirring.

I'm going to be having a quiet word with the Humbrol people at Telford about their QC as I've had a few problems recently

[rickshaw]

I use Vallejo acrylic varnish.   Never had a problem.  The more I use Vallejo paints, the more impressed I am by them.  I just wish they were more generally available downunder.

[Spey_Phantom]

though i'd look into the problem. since i mostly brushpaint it straight from the bottle.
used the clear again on my 1/144 F-22's and it happened again, on the lighter grey is doesnt show, but it does on the darker parts.
i tried cleaning it off with water and thinner, but it keeps coming back (tried it with the shaken bottle, same result).

i find it strange that i didnt have this problem on earlier buit models (had it once, but another coat seemed to have fixed that).
until i can get this problem solved, im going back the old fashion 14ml clear enamel paint tins.

[Captain Canada]

You using the same bottle you had on your earlier successful attempts Nils ? Maybe it's old enough that the thinners and varnish don't want to separate ? And the advice was to stir, not shake. Ask any Bond fan, there is a difference

[Spey_Phantom]

after a little experimentation, i might have found the problem.




by using the same brushes for the clear as i do for the paintwork, i think my bottle of clear has gotten tainted  
even though all my paintbrushes are thoroughly cleaned after use, i think some of the paint and paintcleaner still got stuck in the brushes and so tranfered the impurities to the clear.

i came to the conclusion as i put a few drops of thinner (revell color mix) into the bottle of clear and on impact, the transparent thinner turned white, just like the stains  

then i put a little more thinner in the bottle and gave it a shake (in the hope of thinning out the impurities).
as a result, the clear turned into a more white color, but still had its transparant results.
then i took an old scrapmodel (that was bound for the trash) and i gave it a first coat of clear to see the results.

its been 10 minutes now, no white stains, so im gonna see what happens once the clear has dried.

just to be safe, in the future, im gonna use a seperate set of paintbrushes for the clear, and wash them of with water instead of paintcleaner.

[PR19_Kit]

just to be safe, in the future, im gonna use a seperate set of paintbrushes for the clear, and wash them of with water instead of paintcleaner.

Yes, always a good idea Nils.

I've been doing that for many years, and put a strip of masking tape around the handles of the varnish brushes so they don't get mixed up with the colour ones.

[NARSES2]

just to be safe, in the future, im gonna use a seperate set of paintbrushes for the clear, and wash them of with water instead of paintcleaner.

Yes, always a good idea Nils.

I've been doing that for many years, and put a strip of masking tape around the handles of the varnish brushes so they don't get mixed up with the colour ones.

Exactly the same here Kit. I have separate brushes for enamels, varnish and acrylics. Coloured labels from Smiths distinguish them Red = varnish, green = enamel, yellow = acrylic

[Spey_Phantom]

got an update on the test, it was a failure
made it even worse, might have to throw away the bottle and get a new one  

[Dizzyfugu]

That really looks odd. Another idea: could there have been residual thinner/brush cleaner in the brush when you used the varnish, so that there could be a late reaction after curing on the model? I also had issues with matt varnish, but I never had SUCH a result, with such a cloudy result?!

[Librarian]

I did have this problem some years ago but only with matt varnish (very well stirred) over gloss varnish, and only on White Ensign Japanese Greens (various). Could be a combination reaction. Ended up having to strip and repaint.

[NARSES2]

Now one of the problems I had was over White Ensign paints but the recent one was Xtracrylic. I will be talking to Humbrol at Telford

[Dizzyfugu]

They seem to have changed their enamel formula, e. g. for the matt black - it's more pastous now, and need frequent thinner addition to be kept alive in the tin. But, as a positive effect, it actually results in an even and matte finish! In more than 30 years of model painting with enamels, I had this "success" with the current Humbrol 33.