C.S.A.R. unit.......W.I.P.

[Weaver]

Well if they're serious CSAR, they'll want much the same kit as the USAF birds:

Terrain Following Radar (small radome. Could be podded as on MH-47E)
FLIR (presume your optics mods already provide that?)
Flight Refuelling Boom
Radar Warning Receivers (usually small twin domes or wedges at 45 deg, two on nose, one on each side of tail boom)
Missile Approach Warning sensors (like RWRs but bigger and only side/rear facing)
IR Jammer (Kit might already have one? Facetted drum/dome that goes behind the rotor mast)
Chaff/Flare launchers (multi-cell boxes on sides of tail boom)

Less sure on the nav/com kit, but in general:

LORAN radio-nav kit (long "towel rail" aerial, usually on tail boom)
Loads of other aerials with a good mix of shapes: blades, hockey sticks, T-bars, mini-saucers, the works.

[Army of One]

Those are most of the things I was thinking of....a telescopic IFR probe but weren't sure how it would interfere with the nose gun....hadn't thought of the towel rail. A lot of british helo's have arials  on the nose which look like a small version of nightfighter arials from WW2.....seen them on Gazelle, Chinook, Puma an Merlin.....not so much on RN just RAF n Army......kit comes with IR brick and hot air mixers for exhaust.......

[Captain Canada]

Just gets better and better !

I was reading an article on replacing the Blackhawk with another Blackhawk and it seems the USAF aren't too happy about it ! The Chinook is the way to go on that one ;-)

but let's not get started on that !

[Army of One]

I've thought about doing this for ages.....can't wait to get cutting/glueing plastic.......

[rickshaw]

Nice one Hank! 

Well you've found out why don't have sliding doors: they hit the wing!

My suspicion is that there wouldn't be room for a door gunner. IIRC, the Hind's cabin roof is lower than standing height anyway, so getting ni and out is going to be pretty awkward as it is.

If you want covering fire to the sides, why not modify the 12.7mm gatling in the nose to have 270-360 deg of arc so it can do the job, along with a helmet-mounted sight or pantograph sight (not sure what eera you're going for) for the gunner? You could make the turret deeper by adding a short length of tube to it, or you could scratch a gun body and have the thing in an external cradle, AH-64 style.

Hinds in Afghanistan regularly flew with door gunners, either 7.62mm or 12.7mm IIRC.

The doors on Hinds split horizontally along their length with the top half folding up and the lower half folding down (with a step on it's inside, I believe).  The top halves were often removed to allow the door gunner to swivel his weapon more easily (must have been bloody cold up in those mountains).

[Army of One]

Cheers.... .......I think due to crew doors the IFR probe will be on the starboard side......

[zenrat]

Bit late now but you could have slid the doors forwards.

[Weaver]

Nice one Hank! 

Well you've found out why don't have sliding doors: they hit the wing!

My suspicion is that there wouldn't be room for a door gunner. IIRC, the Hind's cabin roof is lower than standing height anyway, so getting ni and out is going to be pretty awkward as it is.

If you want covering fire to the sides, why not modify the 12.7mm gatling in the nose to have 270-360 deg of arc so it can do the job, along with a helmet-mounted sight or pantograph sight (not sure what eera you're going for) for the gunner? You could make the turret deeper by adding a short length of tube to it, or you could scratch a gun body and have the thing in an external cradle, AH-64 style.

Hinds in Afghanistan regularly flew with door gunners, either 7.62mm or 12.7mm IIRC.

The doors on Hinds split horizontally along their length with the top half folding up and the lower half folding down (with a step on it's inside, I believe).  The top halves were often removed to allow the door gunner to swivel his weapon more easily (must have been bloody cold up in those mountains).

True, but in that case, they wern't carrying troops as well. As I understand it, Hank wants to have a team fast-roping down from the door, so maximum available door width is an issue, given the proximity of the wing.

[rickshaw]

Then you fly with no doors.  They used to remove the doors from the RAAF's Iroquois all the time to allow faster egress.  It was quite exhilarating flying without anything between you and the outside except your seat belt.   

[Army of One]

I had considered doors off......but does that have an effect on the helo at high speed....I may be wrong but years ago was told that a puma was limited to 60knots with doors open.........

[Army of One]

Scratch build two bolt on IFR probes for the starboard side....pass me my gown nurse....let the surgery begin.......

[Weaver]

Then you fly with no doors.  They used to remove the doors from the RAAF's Iroquois all the time to allow faster egress.  It was quite exhilarating flying without anything between you and the outside except your seat belt.   

Taking the doors off doesn't make the doorways any bigger: they are WAY smaller than a Huey. Let me show you what I mean:



Helo and figure both in 1/72nd scale.

If you have a door gunner kneeling in that doorway (and he has to be kneeling: the compartment is that low), at the front (in order to get a decent arc past the wing weapons), then there's just about room to wriggle past the wing weapons and carefully squeeze past him, one at a time, with the aircraft on the ground. If you want to fast-rope four people from both doors then that's going to be awkward even without a gunner.

[Army of One]

10 mins of surgery and I have two of these....not to bad.....



Harold......given up on the door gunner.....seen pics of DOE gunners n seated with the upper door open n lower closed with gun on a sliding rail

[Weaver]

Nice one Hank - why do you want two probes though?

What's DOE?

[Army of One]

Typo.....door gunner......and doing two hinds......