Been wondering about this

[NARSES2]

[I'm not even sure if there are any models of the Dominator available,

Anigrand do a Dominator if you've a taste for expensive resin. I've one in the stash which is slated for a SEAC role someday !

, but the original inspiration for this was my realization that I have two different Halifax kits, and then started thinking about the XB38 and its problems, what could have resulted.

Isn't that part of the core of this forum?

Yup

[wuzak]

The radiators would be in the exact same place as on the Lanc, the Halifax, and the Wellinton bombers; that is, chin mounted, unless, and this'd be extremely unlikely, someone wanted an annular radiator, and the only power to do that was the Germans.

A chin mounted radiator makes the most sense.

The chin mounted radiator could be part of a power egg, which would be a bolt up change for the B-17.

The XB-38 used radiators mounted in the leading edge between the nacelles. I believe the intake below the spinner was for an intercooler. By using this system it required more changes to the base aircraft, and thus less likely to proceed. The V-3420 power egg for the XB-39 was self-contained with all coolers required, and so was a bolt up job to the airframe, yet even with that and its much better performance it was no proceeded with. The small improvement in performance on the XB-38 would have made adoption even less likely.

I suppose the attraction of the V-1710 over the Merlin was that it would bolt up to the B-series turbo that was already in the B-17's nacelle. I think the issue with the exhaust was one of installation, and not an issue that would be ongoing.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a3/XB-38.jpg

http://www.airpages.ru/eng/mn/b17_169.jpg

There was some consideration to using the V-1710 to power some YB-40 escort ships, which could not keep up with the B-17 once the latter had dropped its bombs. But this idea was dropped when the YB-40 proved to be a failure.

[maxmwill]

Those XB-38s were simply gorgeous. So I'm sure a Merlin powered example would look rather nice ! Isn't there a BF-109 engine B-17 on here somewhere ?

Well, if you really do like the XB38 with the Allisons, if you like, seeing as the nacelles appear to be similar to the nose of the P40, why not use those?

Recently, while I was kit shopping on eBay, I found a listing for a whole case of P40 models for something like $35 or so. I think it was something like 24 models total.

[KJ_Lesnick]

Now all I have to do is scrounge a 1/72 B17G(because the XB38 was developed from a G model), although an F model might suffice.

I thought it was a B-17E?

[maxmwill]

The chin mounted radiator could be part of a power egg, which would be a bolt up change for the B-17.

The XB-38 used radiators mounted in the leading edge between the nacelles. I believe the intake below the spinner was for an intercooler. By using this system it required more changes to the base aircraft, and thus less likely to proceed. The V-3420 power egg for the XB-39 was self-contained with all coolers required, and so was a bolt up job to the airframe, yet even with that and its much better performance it was no proceeded with. The small improvement in performance on the XB-38 would have made adoption even less likely.

I suppose the attraction of the V-1710 over the Merlin was that it would bolt up to the B-series turbo that was already in the B-17's nacelle. I think the issue with the exhaust was one of installation, and not an issue that would be ongoing.

[/quote]

So, if the Merlin were used, what would have been the most likely installation, beyond simply bolting it on?

Would the nacelle be modified to allow for a Mustang-type scoop, which would allow the "Meredith Effect" to take place?  Because if memory serves me well enough, the supercharger on the Merlin was integral with the engine itself, along with the same ducting and gills that the Halifax and Lancaster had. I could be mistaken about that, though.

[maxmwill]

I thought it was a B-17E?

[/quote]

I was wrong:

The XB-38 Flying Fortress was a single example conversion of a production B-17E Flying Fortress, testing whether the Allison V-1710 V type engine could be substituted for the standard Wright R-1820 radial engine during early World War II.

[darthspud]

Is all good batting ideas back n forth.
I've got an old book somewhere (Marks & Spencers published it)
Sure it has a profile of a merlin or griffon powered B17 f or g in there somewhere.
If I can get the book, the scanner and some time I'll try and post some pics if you like.

[maxmwill]

Anigrand do a Dominator if you've a taste for expensive resin. I've one in the stash which is slated for a SEAC role someday !


Well, I got a bit curious and looked in eBay for any Dominator kits.

Yes, the Anigrand is pricy.

However, I did fine a kit of the Dominator by Aviation Usk, and it is a vac form with parts in other media, and the bidding on this starts are a bit less than $20. And it is in 1/72 scale.

Now, found a bunch of Shackleton kits in 1/72, and ranging in price from reasonable to a bit ridiculous, so there is that.

[maxmwill]

...and a fifth engine would be nice also...

That would certainly look interesting...

You mean like this:

http://aerofiles.com/boe-jb17g.jpg

Of course, if you want something a bit different bur similar which might make for an interesting diorama:

http://www.airport-data.com/images/aircraft/small/000/405/405182.jpg

[maxmwill]

I found this:

2/31/2009. After WW II, two Vega-built B-17Gs were drastically modified as flying test beds for engines, so a revised Boeing model number of 299Z was assigned to these airframes. The military features were removed, the pilot's compartment was moved aft, and the nose was modified to accommodate the test engine. Each turbo-prop test engine was more powerful than all four standard engines operating together.

The first, s/n 44-85813, was leased to Curtiss-Wright from October 1945, being converted by Boeing in 1946, after which it was designated EB-17G by the USAAC. Test flights with the XT-35 turboprop started in September 1947, tests with the J65 Sapphire jet engine started in 1951. The designation was changed to JB-17G in 1956, while the aircraft was sold to Curtiss-Wright on August 30, 1957, registered as N6694C. Thereafter an R-3350 radial engine was fitted in the nose for propeller research, last engine tested was the T-64G turbine-prop.

Curtiss-Wright sold the aircraft and subsequently it was registered to Ewing Aviation from December 1, 1966, Ewing-Kolb Aircraft from August 15, 1969, Arnold Kolb/Black Hills Aviation from July 30, 1970. The latter had the aircraft fitted with a standard forward fuselage, that was taken from s/n 44-83316, and used it as an aerial tanker, listed as number C12; it crashed near Bear Pen, North Carolina on April 16, 1980.

http://1000aircraftphotos.com/Contributions/GauthierDavidJ/9578.htm

[pyro-manic]

I'd never come across the XB-38 before, but wow it's a looker! I say go for it - I think the Halifax engines would work just fine...

[maxmwill]

I saw pictures of the XB38 many years ago, in a Wings or an Airpower issue, and thought that it was very nice looking, and have kept that in back of my head against the day I decided to model it.

And now, a lot older, (hopefully) a bit wiser, and having done a whole lot more in aviation history research, perhaps I could build that, but a bit improved on the original, with, say, a set of Merlins, if only to give me a better idea as to how it would have looked.

[Weaver]

Can't find the reference now for the life of me, but didn't somebody build a model of a Merlin-engined B-17 which fooled a reference website owner into writing it up as real? IIRC, the back story was that it was a Canadian project and the model had a lot of yellow on it as it was used for air-sea rescue.

[zenrat]

...and a fifth engine would be nice also...

That would certainly look interesting...

You mean like this:

http://aerofiles.com/boe-jb17g.jpg...

Love the look moving the cockpit back gives it.  Couple that with in-line engines and you've got a real Hot Rod.

[KJ_Lesnick]

What advantage/disadvantages does an annular radiator have over the following

• Chin mount (Lancaster/P-40)
  
• Belly Mount (P-51)
  
• Wing-root mounted (Mosquito)
  
• Side-mounted