Anyone remember the Ekranoplan?

[maxmwill]

Yeah, I saw that too, and yes, the Be40 is most definitely not an Ekranoplan, but a flying boat, pure and simple.

Still, I began this thread with the hope that perhaps some speculative discussion would be wrought, and maybe some modelling ideas bandied about.

Isn't that what a whif is all about?

[maxmwill]

I was wondering about the Buccaneer's secret.

[rickshaw]

The problem with the Ekranoplan as a missile carrier is again that the alternatives are better. A conventional aircraft can carry the missiles faster and higher, thus achieving greater radar range for acquisition and greater range from the missile itself. A conventional missile boat is slower than the Ekranoplan, but it can stop dead and wait in a much greater range of weather conditions.

Re ekranoplans in inland waterways, I wonder how many times they have to pull up out of ground-effect to clear boats, ferries and bridges, what that does to their average efficiency, and what the safety authorities have to say about it.....

Not that big a problem on the Volga or Dnieper or similar Russian rivers, I think.  There would be hundreds, if not thousands of kilometres between bridges.  What most people don't appreciate is how under-developed Russia is, even today.   When you see pictures of what they laughingly call "major highways" unsealed with ruts several feet deep, you understand why Russian trucks are all built the way they are!

[rickshaw]

Is the Buccaneer's fabled low level performance in any way due to "Wing in ground effect"?

I would suggest that the Member for Hereford might find they need bigger wings, with a lower loading for it to have any effect.  Buccaneers didn't float over the water, by any stretch of the imagination! 

[rickshaw]

I was wondering about the Buccaneer's secret.

The Buccaneer's secret?  The best traditions of the Royal Navy!  Built like a bloody battleship!   

[maxmwill]

You mean the original Royal Navy, with ships of wood and men of iron?

Of course, as with the US Navy, nowadays, the obverse may be the case<duck and running, with the wide grin of a smart a**>.

[PR19_Kit]

I was wondering about the Buccaneer's secret.

The Buccaneer's secret?  The best traditions of the Royal Navy!  Built like a bloody battleship!   

Ref post #15.............

[Gondor]

I was wondering about the Buccaneer's secret.

The Buccaneer's secret?  The best traditions of the Royal Navy!  Built like a bloody battleship!   

Ref post #15.............

I agree Kit, The structure was built so that you would think the Bucc could go through the waves rather than over them

Gondor

[PR19_Kit]

I was privilaged to see the structural test rig they had at Brough for the Bucc and it made every other airframe rig I've seen look like a toy. Even the C-17 rig at San Diego was made fom Meccano by comparison. Awesome doesn't even start to describe it.

[wuzak]

Perhaps their most ideal use and the one which all too often gets overlooked is not as a strike craft with missiles but as a landing craft.  They would allow amphibious operations mounted over long ranges and at high speeds, landing off the beach and taxiing up to it, to unload their cargoes.    People seem rather mesmerised by their missile carrying capabilities for some reason when in reality, that sort of mission would be better handled by conventional aircraft IMO.

Precisely the purpose of the A-90 Orlyonok



Here's an action shot
http://tof.canardpc.com/view/c855e165-de7e-4a0c-adc3-cba31e0b9fe0.jpg

And unloading an armoured vehicle

[wuzak]

This video shows a prototype ekranoplan. There some shots of it operating on ice and over land (not flat).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2dXElO2OKAs

[PR19_Kit]

This video shows a prototype ekranoplan. There some shots of it operating on ice and over land (not flat).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2dXElO2OKAs

That's pretty interesting, albeit a tad political. And they built at least three of those test versions too.

[maxmwill]

I could care less about political, just that it shows that it was feasible.

You'll have to pardon me, because while I do get involved on political discussions elsewhere, in a forum such as this, I stay as far away from politics and political discussions as I can, simply looking at stuff like the video and idea generators(my motto being: We steal only the best - ideas, that is).

Now for some whifs on this, all the way up to and including a ballistic missile carrier.

[wuzak]

I could care less about political, just that it shows that it was feasible.

You'll have to pardon me, because while I do get involved on political discussions elsewhere, in a forum such as this, I stay as far away from politics and political discussions as I can, simply looking at stuff like the video and idea generators(my motto being: We steal only the best - ideas, that is).

Now for some whifs on this, all the way up to and including a ballistic missile carrier.

Wonder if you could do am aocraft carrier WIG/Ekranoplan.

[maxmwill]

Wow, I never even considered that. I'm serious. A WIG ala the Ekranoplan, only bigger by a significant percentage would be a doable project.

And, now that I am thinking about it, I direct you to any of the current Marvel Comics inspired movies which feature S.H.E.I.L.D. as part of the plot, with their Helicarrier.

I don't mean that you'd have to keep the outrigger mounted lift engines/fans(although the FIW(fan in wing) concept that this is merely an extrapolation of, could be considered, although the p/w ratio might be a tad ludicrous(the weight of the units as opposed to the drag penalties that tend to be inherent in the design itself; just look at all the FIW designs which have been proposed over the years but never quite made it past the experimental stage, save the F35B, and that weapon system is a dog and a loser in its own right, but that could be a subject of discussion at a later date).

But, something that stays in the ground effect regime might benefit from it, although I'm not a good enough engineer to be able to flesh it out beyond mere speculation, because I'm just one of those dumb and dirty aeroplane mechanics.

But, if the Dornier DoX can successfully operate in ground effect(for long distance flight, it usually stayed within a 100 feet or so), perhaps something like this could do likewise, being as big and heavy as it would end up being(aircraft carriers are not known for their small and dainty measurements )