The armed Army Caribou

[maxmwill]

While I might've been the recipient of tall tales from one of my uncles, recently, this got me to thinking.

My uncle was stationed in the Army as one of the crew chiefs in a Caribou squadron, around the time the Army lost all its Caribous to the Air Force.

One the reasons the Air Force demanded and got all Army Caribous was because supposedly there were three hard points on each wing, and the pilot had a joy stick which controlled a pair of 50s on each side of the nose, and that at the one and only demonstration in which this mod was shown, there happened to be several high ranking Air Force officers attending. The inboard and second hard points held napalm tanks, which were dropped on a simulated enemy convoy. The outermost hard points each held a Tiny Tim missile. And the pilot strafed the convoy as well. The Air Force officers were outraged.

Now, it may be that my uncle was telling me a tall tale to simply impress us young'uns, but he is still alive, and does stick with the original tale, so perhaps there might have been some actual substance to it.

I can't find a mention of anything like that taking place, but it is well known that the Air Force did take control of most of the Army's 'bous, with various reasons given.

Still, as a whif..............................................

[kerick]

So who's gonna build it first? 

[maxmwill]

Well, I have to confess that I don't know of a Caribou in any scale, but I do know how I'd configure the model, as there was a large twin during WW2 which did have a pair of 50s on each side of the cockpit, and there is a really nice(and expensive) 1/32 scale kit of that.

Ok, I know more now, there being at least three kits of the 'bou, two in  quarter scale and one in 1/72.

[McColm]

HobbyBoss do a 1/72 kit.

[kerick]

Air America flying in SEA?

[maxmwill]

No, my uncle was stateside, and was a crew crew chief/mechanic in a Caribou squadron, but never went over seas, that much I know for sure.

Another uncle was a commando before there was a Special Forces or Rangers, and was involved in something that had to do with a lake in China and candiru catfish, something I found out about at his funeral when those members of his squad who were still alive reminisced about it.

But, even if my one uncle had been spinning a tall tale all these years about an armed Caribou, it would make for an interesting whif, especially if you can scrounge a Tiny Tim missile in the chosen scale.

[rickshaw]

I've never heard of an armed Caribou, nor that it could have any nose mounted weapons of any kind (where would they put them?  There's very little room in the nose of the Caribou).

The only "special forces" allied unit that I know of that operated in China was Special Mission 21 - a joint British, Australian and IIRC New Zealand unit which was especially raised, just before the Japanese attack to proceed to China and operate with the Nationalists to try and keep them in the war, when Churchill feared they would make a separate peace with Japan.  Churchill saw the Chinese and in particular the KMT as being like the Soviets - the main force to do the fighting and bleed the enemy dry until the western Allies could organise and equip themselves well enough to come in at the last minute and clean up the mess.

Special Mission 204 made an epic overland journey from Burma, along the Burma Road, across SW China to central China where, unfortunately the Nationalists kept them cooling their heels for nearly 12 months before they were recalled.  They contracted some very peculiar tropical diseases and parasites along the way and spent a large part of the journey either sick or getting better, before getting sick again.

[famvburg]

HobbyCraft made a 1/72 injected kit, Combat does or did make a 1/72 vac kit and AModel make several 1/144 variants. Seems like there was a 1/72 resin kit as well.

[Captain Canada]

Very interesting ! Now I need to know more. There was a book I had read awhile back about their exploits in Vietnam, but it was mostly concerned with their ability to ascend and alight in about an arms length. No mention of them being armed. Larry Milberry has an excellent book out about DHC, maybe there would be a mention of it in there ?

I was digging through my styrene cave looking for my second Hobbycrap kit. The one is already chopped up to become an AEW type, but I wanted the second one to bash up as a CDN Army type. If I can find it, it might just find itself sporting some nose mounted .50s and underwing hard points !

[kitnut617]

HobbyCraft made a 1/72 injected kit, Combat does or did make a 1/72 vac kit and AModel make several 1/144 variants. Seems like there was a 1/72 resin kit as well.

Combat Models do a 1/72 Buffalo (got one in the stash), not seen a Caribou on their website but can't recheck as the website is being re-constructed and nothing is showing up at the moment.  Got three of the Hobbycraft Caribous though ---

[kitnut617]

There might be a bit of truth in your story if you read this article about the ones that went to India, they got used as 'night-bomber'

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/Aircraft/Specs/549-DHC4-Caribou.html

Lately, the Aeromilitaria magazine quarterlies I get from Air-Britain, have been running articles about various clandestine operations done in a number of African countries, a variable mixed bag of aircraft not remotely connected to any airforce previously were all armed and used which I can't find anything about on the internet. Most had a CIA connection so arming some 'surplus to requirement' Caribous doesn't sound to far fetched.

[maxmwill]

Well, as a suggestion, this is what my uncle was referring to when the 50s were mounted on the Caribou, two to a side, the being of a B25:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/db/B-25_Mitchell_50-calibre_machine_gun_blister_mounts.jpg

I hope this helps.

[Captain Canada]

I don't see why it wouldn't work. And if you ever watch those videos of the 'Bou wagging it's tail, there would be quite the spray pattern in front of her !

[maxmwill]

Well, if you put the gun pod on a pivot so it travels a few degrees up and a few degrees down, and connect that to a side mounted joystick for the pilot to manipulate one-handed whilst on a strafing run, in order to soften up the landing zone a bit..................

[Go4fun]

You have to remember that the Air Force was always want to control all fixed wing aircraft since their inception. It was sort of settled with the Florida Concord in which the Air Force had all of the armed aircraft and Army Aviation craft were for artillery spotting, aerial rescue and scouting only.
The Army tried sneaking around this several times and I think I read where the demonstration mentioned DID happen and the Air Force came unglued. This same battle went on between the Air Force and Navy when the carrier was created with the AF wanting to run the aircraft off of Navy ships. You see where that ended up.