Rail stock aircraft launching car/wagon

[McColm]

Hi Guys,
I came across a Ho/00 Hornby/Triang  Battlespace R562- aircraft launching car (wagon) on eBAY. I know this was marketed as a toy, but I was wondering if this was a "Real World" idea?

The scales are different 1/76 compared to 1/72, but a Jaguar or Hawk could be on a launcher parked in a siding with support vehicles. Or be used as a rocket launcher.
Bi-planes or mobile catapults.

[Captain Canada]

Harrier !

I think there may have already been some discussion on a similar platform on here already. Might have been the old site tho.

[sandiego89]

Make sure it is OO and not HO.  HO is actually about 1/87 scale.  

I/72 scale aircraft look funny next to HO scale (aircraft are noticeably too big)- you can notice the difference.  You would think it would be close enough, but 1/72 and 1/87 was not close enough for me anyway.  Hot wheel/matchbox cars do pretty well.  

There are some great HO rail cars out there, but sourcing suitable aircraft can be difficult.  Sadly HO aircraft are quite rare, and few military subjects.  HO tends to be crazy expensive- they must think those railroad guys are made of money  

OO is closer, but might look a bit off with 1/72 aircraft.  Perhaps "close enough" for fun builds. 

There were some real world rail car missile launcher concepts, and I seem to recall someone here planning a harrier train, with landing gear removed?  

I did a HO scale Rhodesian Combat support train on WHIF for the Africa Group Build, and had to shorten down my Gazelle helicopter to look closer.  

The blue tail section was from a 1/72 Gazelle, and the tan German helo (105/117?) is in 1/87.  You can see how much bigger 1/72 is even for 2 helicopters that are similar in size in real world.  



Mated together.



The Land Rover and Unimogs are HO- 1/87 scale, and were rather expensive.    

[PR19_Kit]

Make sure it is OO and not HO.  HO is actually about 1/87 scale.  

But OO is 1/76 scale.

It's a zillion times more common in the UK than HO, and makes much more sense when matching to a 1/72 aircraft.

[sandiego89]

Make sure it is OO and not HO.  HO is actually about 1/87 scale.  

But OO is 1/76 scale.

Understood, the first post said it was listed as Ho/OO.....so I was just trying to help as ebay listings are not always 100%.   

[McColm]

Thanks for your help.

[zenrat]

I always thought HO & OO were the same.
Seems you do learn something new every day!

[martinbayer]

For fixed winged airplanes, looking at the velocity difference between an average freight train railroad car and the required takeoff speed of an airplane, there are not too many airplanes that could pull of a stunt like that from an actual moving freight train without a catapult, based on pure physics. But as an example, one of them would probably be the Fieseler Storch, aka Fi-156, or one of its carbon copies like the MS-500 that had folding wings, and which in my impressionable youth I always fancied would been a nice means of escape for an action hero (and, if need be, his female interest ) from a train by floating off a flatbed car if need be - I imagined the plane would almost take off vertically (in a coordinate system relative to the train) at the same speed as the train once released from any restraints. Realistically, higher speed trains, like the TGV or the Shinkansen, are confined to passenger transport, but in whifworld, of course you could have 'special' cars at the very end of the train that are dedicated to launching aircraft (assuming they have swing wings and fit the envelope of a fake passenger coach car), so depending on type you would have to correlate geometrical aircraft cross section size and rotation velocity (or in addition take into account the benefit of any additional catapult acceleration) to determine feasibility.

Martin

[zenrat]

Check this out

[Hobbes]

Hi Guys,
I came across a Ho/00 Hornby/Triang  Battlespace R562- aircraft launching car (wagon) on eBAY. I know this was marketed as a toy, but I was wondering if this was a "Real World" idea?

The scales are different 1/76 compared to 1/72, but a Jaguar or Hawk could be on a launcher parked in a siding with support vehicles. Or be used as a rocket launcher.
Bi-planes or mobile catapults.

Missile trains were developed and used in real life:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RT-23_Molodets - around 50 deployed
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peacekeeper_Rail_Garrison - designed but cancelled

Launching an aircraft from a train is difficult: the aircraft must be folded up to fit the loading gauge, and you need VTOL, so you're combining 2 techniques that contribute to increase aircraft weight and reduce payload.

[PR19_Kit]

I always thought HO & OO were the same.
Seems you do learn something new every day!

It's complicated, naturally. 

Both use the same track and gauge, at 16.5 mm wide, but HO rolling stock and structures are 3.5 mm/ft whereas 00 is 4 mm/ft. This came about because of the 1/1 scale UK loading gauge, being quite small compared to European and US loading gauges. When the manufacturers started to make 'Half 0' gauge in the 1920s it was difficult to fit the motors, both clockwork and electric, into the smaller bodies of UK models so they kept the track gauge the same as HO but made the bodies a tad larger.

The same difference obtains in N gauge, while all N gauge track is 9 mm apart, UK N gauge rolling stock and structures are 1/148 scale and Euro and US stuff is 1/160 scale. There are also the JMNs of the N gauge world who work in 2 mm/ft scale, which works out as  1/152....... 

See, it's educational here as well. 

[McColm]

Interesting video and info. Makes me want to get hold of a Hornby or Lima HST 125 and paint it drab olive with matt yellow lines. Rolling stock could be Whiffed, taking the toy out and adding more details. Possible vertical platform in a siding.
I'll have to see if my nephews have finished playing with their Military Zone/ Combat Zone layout.

[Mossie]

Launching an aircraft from a train is difficult: the aircraft must be folded up to fit the loading gauge, and you need VTOL, so you're combining 2 techniques that contribute to increase aircraft weight and reduce payload.

Naval ZELL aircraft.  Grumman proposed the Tiger for ZELL as the stronger airframe would be suited to the stresses and the folding wings would make it easier to transport:

[Weaver]

I always thought HO & OO were the same.
Seems you do learn something new every day!

It's complicated, naturally. 

Both use the same track and gauge, at 16.5 mm wide, but HO rolling stock and structures are 3.5 mm/ft whereas 00 is 4 mm/ft. This came about because of the 1/1 scale UK loading gauge, being quite small compared to European and US loading gauges. When the manufacturers started to make 'Half 0' gauge in the 1920s it was difficult to fit the motors, both clockwork and electric, into the smaller bodies of UK models so they kept the track gauge the same as HO but made the bodies a tad larger.

The same difference obtains in N gauge, while all N gauge track is 9 mm apart, UK N gauge rolling stock and structures are 1/148 scale and Euro and US stuff is 1/160 scale. There are also the JMNs of the N gauge world who work in 2 mm/ft scale, which works out as  1/152....... 

See, it's educational here as well. 

At least with HO/OO and HO you clearly know what size a vehicle or piece of scenery is going to be, but if it just says "N-gauge" you're left guessing as to whether it's 1/148th (works with 1/144th models) or 1/160th (too small)...

[Weaver]

Launching an aircraft from a train is difficult: the aircraft must be folded up to fit the loading gauge, and you need VTOL, so you're combining 2 techniques that contribute to increase aircraft weight and reduce payload.

Naval ZELL aircraft.  Grumman proposed the Tiger for ZELL as the stronger airframe would be suited to the stresses and the folding wings would make it easier to transport:

The only problem with that is that the Tiger's standard wingfold wasn't particularly helpful: just a couple of feet of tip folded, and that downwards. Shouldn't be too hard to change it though, given that there's no u/c in the wings.