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Fisher P-75 versus Davis Manta

Started by KJ_Lesnick, July 25, 2015, 05:11:06 PM

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KJ_Lesnick

July 25, 2015, 05:11:06 PM Last Edit: February 14, 2016, 05:46:43 PM by KJ_Lesnick
I saw an old thread awhile back* about David R. Davis's Manta Aircraft Corporation's product: The Davis Manta; seemingly everybody found the aircraft to be quite interesting.

I'm not sure if the design would have met the specifications and could have been built with Davis' limited resources: It honestly seemed to be a pretty good design on paper (provided resources existed) and better than the Fischer P-75 Eagle in terms of range (3,500 miles @ 350 miles per hour), with the same top-speed, making it suitable as a potential bomber-escort.  Despite it's size, it really wasn't much different than the P-38 (Manta: Length ~40'0", Span = 50'0"; Lightning: Length = 37'10"; Span = 52'10") and about the same amount of power.


BTW: The thread I'm referencing was created by Weaver 11/22/2010, and I posted a new thread for a simple reason: The information available was very little, over time people often turn up more information, and this forum is loaded with aviation buffs.
That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.

PR19_Kit

#1
July 26, 2015, 02:45:52 AM
Isn't this the third time you've posted this?

I can distinctly remember one earlier version to which JCF replied commenting that it had appeared some time ago anyway, and I'm pretty sure another version of it was posted between that one and this one.............
Kit's Rule 1 ) Any aircraft can be improved by fitting longer wings, and/or a longer fuselage
Kit's Rule 2) The backstory can always be changed to suit the model

...and I'm not a closeted 'Take That' fan, I'm a REAL fan! :)

Regards
Kit

kitnut617

#2
July 26, 2015, 06:05:42 AM
Yes, she's deleted all the answers she doesn't like out of the previous posts and keeps starting another---  :angry:
If I'm not building models, I'm out riding my dirtbike

Captain Canada

#3
July 26, 2015, 06:25:58 AM
Tophe has some pretty neat versions.

:cheers:
CANADA KICKS arse !!!!

Long Live the Commonwealth !!!
Vive les Canadiens !
Where's my beer ?

KJ_Lesnick

#4
July 26, 2015, 07:47:05 PM Last Edit: July 26, 2015, 08:36:44 PM by KJ_Lesnick
PR19_Kit

QuoteIsn't this the third time you've posted this?
JCF screwed up the thread: He falsely accused me of creating the thread I referenced and accused me of basically bringing up the same old crap (I wanted to re-open a discussion as new information comes out periodically, and it was an interesting topic).  Even though I explained my case in response: Nobody listened.  So I effectively deleted the old thread; then posted an exact copy.

I guess it was too fresh in everybody's minds and nobody responded, so I deleted and reposted again
That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.

PR19_Kit

#5
July 26, 2015, 10:31:00 PM
Maybe no further information on the subject has surfaced, which would prevent anyone from commenting further. If they wanted to of course....
Kit's Rule 1 ) Any aircraft can be improved by fitting longer wings, and/or a longer fuselage
Kit's Rule 2) The backstory can always be changed to suit the model

...and I'm not a closeted 'Take That' fan, I'm a REAL fan! :)

Regards
Kit

jcf

#6
July 26, 2015, 11:59:33 PM
No further information has surfaced because there wasn't any, it was frigging vapourware.

Gondor

#7
July 27, 2015, 01:15:58 AM
Quote from: KJ_Lesnick on July 26, 2015, 07:47:05 PM

I wanted to re-open a discussion as new information comes out periodically, and it was an interesting topic


Threads can still be posted to even when you get the red wording saying that the thread has not been posted to for however long it says. I have done this several times when I have started working on an old build and have not posted to that thread for months or even years!

What you may call interesting for a topic others may not, if they were interested in then they would respond about that topic rather than complain about the fact you only ask questions and extremely rarely contribute anything to anyone else's threads.

Gondor
My Ability to Imagine is only exceeded by my Imagined Abilities

Gondor's Modelling Rule Number Three: Everything will fit perfectly untill you apply glue...

I know it's in a book I have around here somewhere....

KJ_Lesnick

#8
July 27, 2015, 06:42:13 PM
PR19_Kit

QuoteMaybe no further information on the subject has surfaced, which would prevent anyone from commenting further. If they wanted to of course....
Yeah, I remember hearing that some members on Beyond the Sprues actually didn't answer my questions when they had the information: Seems awfully petty.


joncarrfarrelly

QuoteNo further information has surfaced because there wasn't any
If there wasn't anymore information on the plane: Is there any information on David R. Davis?  I'm curious about some things regarding that, such as

  • Why did he work free-lance instead of working with a corporation?
  • Why didn't he just work with Consolidated: He did propose the fluid-foil design with them and was to use the same basic concept on the Manta design
  • The Manta design had stated as a long-ranged fighter concept as early as 1935: All he needed was a contractor to have developed it.

Gondor

Quoteif they were interested in then they would respond about that topic rather than complain about the fact you only ask questions
What's wrong with asking questions?  As for contributions -- I can contribute, I just don't know if anybody would have any interest in what I have to say...
That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.

McColm

#9
July 27, 2015, 09:05:18 PM
Wow! I do that a lot on this site re-visit old posts for inspiration. Sometimes I'm not too sure where to put them. Does this site have objection to be mentioned on Twitter?

KJ_Lesnick

#10
July 29, 2015, 05:17:03 PM
McColm

QuoteWow! I do that a lot on this site re-visit old posts for inspiration.
At least I'm not the only one...

QuoteDoes this site have objection to be mentioned on Twitter?
You could ask the following

  • overscan
  • Supertom
  • Thorvic
  • NARSES2
That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.

KJ_Lesnick

#11
August 02, 2015, 06:13:34 PM
I'm curious if it would have been possible to have done a couple of things such as

  • Enlarge the propeller arc
  • Lengthen the nose gear similar to the P-39, giving it a slight nose-high attitude
  • Different gun arrangement
That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.

Caveman

#12
August 03, 2015, 06:02:10 AM
Certainly would be possible, the degree of difficulty would depend on the scale of the changes. What prompted you to ask about those specific changes?
secretprojects forum migrant

KJ_Lesnick

#13
August 03, 2015, 07:07:50 PM Last Edit: August 03, 2015, 07:10:45 PM by KJ_Lesnick
Quote from: Caveman on August 03, 2015, 06:02:10 AMCertainly would be possible, the degree of difficulty would depend on the scale of the changes. What prompted you to ask about those specific changes?
Simple

  • The longer nose gear would make possible a bigger propeller
  • The propeller arc on the Manta seemed small, compared to the XP-75 Eagle: Considering both had the same engines, a bigger propeller would provide more power.
  • The cannon/guns on the Manta were far spaced apart requiring an elaborate convergence scheme; it seems simpler to put one of the following: 1 x 20mm cannon in the propeller hub + 4 x 12.7mm in the nose with a synch gear; 6 x 12.7mm in the nose with a synch gear.
That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep); should I be framed for a criminal offense or disappear, you know to blame.

Caveman

#14
August 04, 2015, 05:57:40 AM
"Elaborate convergence" just checking - you know that convergence is just angling the guns right?

That is far simpler than designing guns/engine-gearbox combos to fire through hubs or interrupter gears.

Greater diameter of propellor =! More power. If you want a sweeping generalisation large props are better for slow heavy lifting whilst small props are better for speed.

Thrust from prop disk depends on mass of air and the amount it has been accelerated. So a small prop giving lots of acceleration to the air provides the same thrust as a large prop giving a smaller acceleration to the air. Large and slow tends to be more fuel efficient but the aircraft cannot travel faster than the speed the air is chucked out of the prop.
secretprojects forum migrant
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