Change of missiles intended use.

[chrisonord]

I have in the weapons stash some missiles that I won't use for their intended purpose, these being bull pup- b's and matra r 530's. The bullpups are a nice size to not be too big a weapon to hang from a helicopter and be used as a short to medium range anti radar missile. The technology is out there to fit anti radar gubbins into a sidewinder missile so why not do said thing with a stock pile of agm-12b's??
Also while I am at it, I have a few of the magic 530's, to me they look wrong as an air to air missile, and look more like an air to ground munition to me anyway. I was thinking of changing these into an anti radar missile too, anderhaps even something that can be used against a ship, especially its radar. I will have to give them both new names and identities of course. The Argentinian Martin percessor(spell check that will you dear) is also quite similar in shape to the bullpup, so maybe there could be involvement with them in the conversion, but I think I will hand the contract to IAI 
If this is in the wrong place, please could brother Narses point it in the right direction. Ta.
Chris.

[sandiego89]

F-102's (and a few other aircraft) did launch Falcon IR missiles at suspected targets in Vietnam on occasion.  A rather expensive way to attack a truck, but likely the best use for the un-loved Falcon....

[Snowtrooper]

Repurposing missiles is actually more common than you think 

Besides AGM-122 Sidearm, a "conventional" air-to-ground variant of the Sidewinder was actually considered, the AGM-87 Focus. AIM-47 Falcon (which eventually led to AIM-54 Phoenix), was first supposed to have an air-to-ground nuclear variant AGM-76 Falcon which in turn was planned to have a non-nuclear ARM variant too.

Of the missiles that actually went into production as something else, AGM-45 Shrike is really just an AIM-7 Sparrow with new wings and ARM gubbins. AGM-78 Standard ARM, as the name implies, is just an air-launched RIM-66 Standard with ARM gubbins but without booster. Then you have the air-to-air missile based SAM's, ie. Chapparal, Sea Sparrow, NASAMS...

Used as is, the Swedes were even planning to use the optically guided Rb 05 AGM to guarantee a kill against large but unmanoeuvrable transport planes (presumably they had tried hitting a drone first to prove the feasibility of this).

tl;dr: your idea sounds perfectly feasible in light of what has been done already.

[Weaver]

Martin Pescador dear - put your glasses on...

Bullpup designations were made very confusing by it first being adopted by the USAF and then given new codes that didn't make a lot of sense in the 1963 unified codes revision: http://www.designation-systems.net/dusrm/m-12.html

I presume the missiles you have are the small ones with a 250lb warhead? If so, then they were so suitable for helicopter use than they were actually cleared for the job in real life, according to the site above. I see no reason why a Bullpup airframe couldn't be fitted with an anti-radar homing head, but it would change the shape of the nose quite a bit.

The Matra R.530 would be highly suitable as an anti-radar missile since it already had a semi-active radar seeker in the nose: more or less like converting a Sparrow to a Shrike. Matra actually developed the anti-radar head for the AS.37 MARTEL missile so they certainly had the capability. It might need a new rocket motor with a longer burn and less acceleration, and the warhead and fuse would need to be optimised for air-to-ground work too. This would actually be a highly credible use for old R.530s as they were replaced in the air-to-air role by the Super 530D.

Note that the 'Magic' name only applies to the smaller R.550 missile, which looks like a Sidewinder with two sets of forward control fins.

[chrisonord]

Cheers for that, it looks like the "museum" box is going to get raided then, and the missiles pressed into Honduras air force service. I also have a quantity of falcon  air to air missiles, that could get reassigned as ship to ship weapons, unless someone wants them of course. I have a few Shrike 's knocking about too, these will get their pensions took off them and given a job too.
Chris

[Mossie]

Martel morphed into Sea Eagle, a role it was much better suited to:

[chrisonord]

They are a hefty old missile too the Sea Eagle aren't they. Are they still in service here? as wondering if they would fit inside an F-35's weapons bay. Unless they stuck them on Pylons. My next project includes the use of slightly reassigned missiles, air launched Pac 3 Patriot missiles, and a modified version of RIM-161, may also get hung on the aircraft I am building. No, it's neither Honduran, Cartel, or American. 
Chris

[Weaver]

No, all the UK's Sea Eagles were withdrawn without replacement....

Think the only user now is India. Pity: by all accounts it's a good weapon. Still seemed an odd thing to develop when we'd already picked Exocets and Harpoons for the Navy (and the Nimrods) and both of those came in air-launched versions.

Incidentally, the RN's surface-launched Harpoons are running out of shelf life and the 'plan' to replace those is running late, so there will probably be a period of years where we have no national anti-big-ship capability at all......  <squared>

[PR19_Kit]

Incidentally, the RN's surface-launched Harpoons are running out of shelf life and the 'plan' to replace those is running late, so there will probably be a period of years where we have no national anti-big-ship capability at all......  <squared>

You must be mistaking the Ministry of Defence with an organisation that's meant to defend the country..........

[Getting dangerously close to being political here, sorry]

[Old Wombat]

You must be mistaking the Ministry of Defence with an organisation that's meant to defend the country..........

[Getting dangerously close to being political here, sorry]

That would be like accusing governments of caring for the people .....

(Also getting dangerously close to being political. Oops!)

[rickshaw]

getting dangerously close to being political. Oops!

You both seem to be "Yes, Minister/Yes, Prime Minister" fans...   

[PR19_Kit]

getting dangerously close to being political. Oops!

You both seem to be "Yes, Minister/Yes, Prime Minister" fans...   

You mean there are people that aren't? 

[Rheged]

getting dangerously close to being political. Oops!

You both seem to be "Yes, Minister/Yes, Prime Minister" fans...   

You mean there are people that aren't? 

It's possible that there may be , but I've never met any of them.

[chrisonord]

No, all the UK's Sea Eagles were withdrawn without replacement....

Think the only user now is India. Pity: by all accounts it's a good weapon. Still seemed an odd thing to develop when we'd already picked Exocets and Harpoons for the Navy (and the Nimrods) and both of those came in air-launched versions.

Incidentally, the RN's surface-launched Harpoons are running out of shelf life and the 'plan' to replace those is running late, so there will probably be a period of years where we have no national anti-big-ship capability at all......  <squared>

That sounds about right that does, in an ideal world they would have adapted the Typhoon to carry them, as it can carry just about everything else in our inventory. The air launched Patriot and RIM 161's are going to be used as air launched anti ballistic missile, missiles. They will be carried by a long range high speed interceptor I have plans for, and that I am currently constructing some of.
Chris.

[Thorvic]

To be honest the Sea Eagle and Navy Harpoon issue is all part of the Cold War dividend or FUBAR. There really isn't a viable off the shelf new solution available just yet. With Iraq and Afghanistan, focus went on smart bombs and minimal collateral damage weapons. Unfortunately those on the receiving end in the East have continued with Missile Development across the full spectrum of types and the West has been caught napping. Only the smaller weapons like Norwegian Penguin and Sea Skua have been actively replaced, nobody seems too willing to invest in the hypersonic ship killers and the work that involves, all eyes wait on what the US Navy actually selects.

As for re-rolled missiles, ASRAAM is now effectively CAMM, which is now Sea Cepter a Sea Wolf replacement, and is to be used by the Army as an Air Defence missile. From BSP:4 there Air to Surface version and I seem to recall an Air Launched Rapier too