Mexican Panzer IIs

[nev]

OK, inspired by Chris I may do myself a Mexican Pz II, only problem is doing it different enough to make it look like something other than a normal Pz II.  Something that makes you go "oooh, thats different".

Chris has suggested

Apart from dust shields for northern operations and maybe extra stowed fuel tanks, I don't think you'd need much else for a Mexican Pz II.

Any other suggestions as to what I could do?  The one good thing about making this a what-if is I can ignore all the innacuracies in the Tamiya kit  

What about a camo scheme or markings?

And what about the crew/mexican army?  What kind of uniform would they have?  A variation on German uniforms? What colours?  Fitting in with the scenario I'm sure the army would be using German weapons.

Basically, I guess I want something that is recognisably German, but with a Mexican look (and NO sombrero gags!)

[Swamphen]

but with a Mexican look (and NO sombrero gags!)

Drat!  

Well, in that case, you could have the tank be named "Manyana..."   :dum:  

[Bryan H.]

For a serious Mexican Panzer give it a dark olive pant scheme with the red, white & green triangle insignia.

For a less serious panzer, you could give it hydraulics, paint it a lurid metallic lime-green with lots of chrome accents and put a decal of the Virgin of Guadalupe on it!  

Bryan

[dragon]

The Mexicans are very proud of their heritage.  I suppose something aluding to the Aztecs, Pancho Villa, or name the tank after a city (Guadalajara is the name of an important city in Mexico and the name of one of the most recognized mariachi song- you have probably heard it).  Take a look at their transport aircraft- some have Aztec-type designs on them.


Current Mexican Tank

[NARSES2]

My view is that any Pz II's would be part of the elite of a Mexican Army, thus you can do it in Parade style with a very smart colour scheme (Gloss Olive Green sounds good) and small national flags on the turret etc. Or do it in campaign style with dirty paintwork and loads of baggage/loot with maybe a very large Mexican Flag drapped over the rear decking for air identification ?

As for weapons, I feel that the Mexican's would have Italian small arms and medium machine guns rather than German.

Uniforms ? Well as an elite unit the parade uniform could reflect the "glory" days of Santa Anna ? Pick any one of the elite cavalry units - especially the lancers who wore the mexican style of black "boater", rather like piccadores in the bull-ring. On campaign then any Latin army would soon end up in as comfortable a set of dusty brown fatigues as possible, with the officers probably having some sort of fairly obvious rank badges similar to the British army at the start of WWI.

For ideas on Mexican military uniform see the Osprey Book "Santa Anna's Army" - I can post some scans if it would be useful.

Chris

[noxioux]

The real question is how you would handle the whole racial purity and Aryan superiority thing with a standing mexican Nazi army.   I'm sure that the mixture of european and native south americans would have Hitler foaming at the mouth.

What, did they leave all the SS home?

I'm not trying to shoot anyone down here, I'm just really curious about how you'd handle that in the back-story.

[Gary]

Kill Hitler off. He was already suffering from some form of neurological disorder at the time of the assisanation attempt. That leaves a few other "nice" guys who may not have been quite as insane, but equally evil.

Another tact might be the supposed union of the two but really as a feint to take over a new part of the world.

[dragon]

What year would the scenario take place?  Remember, the only reason that Mexico actually sent fighting men to war was because of the outrageous sinking of Mexican owned/operated/crewed Oil tankers near Mexican shores (and the Nazi reaction of indiference when diplomatic protests were launched).  They really wanted to fight the Nazis but got convinced to fight the Japanese by FDR.  I would guess that Germany would have to apologize in some major way.  Can't imagine how that would be achieved.   Now the racial purity thing could be treated the same way that the Nazis treated the Japanese- have the Aztecs named as the master race of the Americas!

[NARSES2]

The real question is how you would handle the whole racial purity and Aryan superiority thing with a standing mexican Nazi army.   I'm sure that the mixture of european and native south americans would have Hitler foaming at the mouth.

What, did they leave all the SS home?

I'm not trying to shoot anyone down here, I'm just really curious about how you'd handle that in the back-story.

In my scenario they are not Nazi but a Mexican form of Italian Fascism - which is no where near the same thing. Therefore the racial purity thing dosn't come into it.

As for timescale - again in mine we are talking early/mid 1942 after the US defeat at Midway. The Central/S American's do not have to be allied to the German/Italian's, they are simply pursuing their own agenda's which happens to involve "possible£" conflict against one of the Axis enemy's.

Chris

[Joe C-P]

As for timescale - again in mine we are talking early/mid 1942 after the US defeat at Midway. The Central/S American's do not have to be allied to the German/Italian's, they are simply pursuing their own agenda's which happens to involve "possible£" conflict against one of the Axis enemy's.

Chris

In that case I'd say the best parallel would be WW2 Finland - fighting the Russians, they got help from the Nazis, and eventually punished by the Allies even though the Soviets had been the aggressors. "The enemy of my enemy is my friend." The big question is how many supplies could Germany have shipped to Mexico before they were cut off? Even if the USN was defeated at Midway, that only delays the war; the US ship production system was expanding, and they certainly had sufficient older ships and aircraft in the Atlantic to cut off any significant trade. Perhaps a few blockade runners might make it, but in 1942 the Caribbean was under US-UK-Dutch control. Subs can't carry tanks.

Wooksta, Chile was friendly with the RN, and Chile had an unfriendly relationship with their neighbor Argentina. Chile even offered to send the BB Almirante Latorre to the US for upgrade during WW2.

With the various relationships and animosities, and resentment over US military interventions, Latin America could have become quite a war zone during WW2. Most of the fighting would have been confined to between neighboring countries, and the Allies would have had the advantage in supplying their chosen allies, but it would have been a major distraction from the main battlegrounds.

[NARSES2]

Chris

In that case I'd say the best parallel would be WW2 Finland - fighting the Russians, they got help from the Nazis, and eventually punished by the Allies even though the Soviets had been the aggressors. "The enemy of my enemy is my friend." The big question is how many supplies could Germany have shipped to Mexico before they were cut off? Even if the USN was defeated at Midway, that only delays the war; the US ship production system was expanding, and they certainly had sufficient older ships and aircraft in the Atlantic to cut off any significant trade. Perhaps a few blockade runners might make it, but in 1942 the Caribbean was under US-UK-Dutch control. Subs can't carry tanks.

[/quote]
Absolutely Joe

Again in my scenario the Mexican and allied forces have no intention of waging war on it's northern neighbour, iritating the hell out of them possibly, they are just taking advantage of the US's difficulties with Japan. In reality they can expect no aid and will have to fight with what they have got, which should be enough for their planned expansions ? As for conflict up north - we will have to wait and see how it plans out.

If anyone want's to read about what inter S American wars can be like then read up on the Paraguyan, Uraguay, Brazilian & Argentinian wars of the mid 1800's - brutal or what.

Chris

[Captain Canada]

I'd say go with the dark green camo, and incorporate a large flag or the triangle idea onto it.

It would also benefit from lots of mgs.

Have fun !