Irish Air Corps

[Geoff]

The only problem with hiding  dispersed aircraft in the lumpy bits of the Highlands is the scarcity of flat bits long enough to make suitable runways. 

Lochs...................

Seaplanes.............

Even applicable to parts of Eire too.

Do I detect possible operators for the  Saro SR A1?

F-104 JATO

[Nick]

The only problem with hiding  dispersed aircraft in the lumpy bits of the Highlands is the scarcity of flat bits long enough to make suitable runways. 

Lochs...................

Seaplanes.............

Even applicable to parts of Eire too.

Do I detect possible operators for the  Saro SR A1?

The RNLI have 5 inland lifeboat stations. One is Loch Ness in Scotland. The other 4 are in Ireland at Carrybridge, Enniskillen, Lough Derg and Lough Ree. 

Plenty of long inlets and river estuaries to have bases on - Foynes is the obvious one. Cobh harbour, Galway Bay, Lough Swilly, Carlingford, even the Liffey!

[scooter]

The only problem with hiding  dispersed aircraft in the lumpy bits of the Highlands is the scarcity of flat bits long enough to make suitable runways. 

Lochs...................

Seaplanes.............

Even applicable to parts of Eire too.

Do I detect possible operators for the  Saro SR A1?

F-104 JATO

F-104 ZELL?

[Weaver]

Another source of Irish decals: KP's SF-260D/W is available in a European Users boxing that includes Irish, Belgian, Danish and UK Civilian schemes.
What's more, Hannants currently have these on sale at £8.40 : https://www.hannants.co.uk/product/KPM72212?result-token=z2jV4

Note that this scheme DOES include tail flashes, unlike Magister kits. Obviously, all the markings are rather small, to match the aircraft.



KP also make an SF-260TP Turbo Warrior (which is also on sale at the same price), so you could do a subtle whiff by putting the Irish markings on one of those:
https://www.hannants.co.uk/product/KPM72213?result-token=z2jV4

[AeroplaneDriver]

I'm guessing 1/72 SF-260 markings would fit fairly well on a lot of 1/144 jets. 

[Beermonster58]

After due consideration, I've decided to dust off my Airfix F-84F Thunderstreak and, JP.4 . I found enough Irish roundels for both in my spares box!! Actually, A T.33/ F.80C might look nice similarly bedecked! For my afore mentioned Scottish Republic Air Force, my next item will be the SAAB Viggen. Using the old Airfix kit(s) - I have three of them!. Needless to say, they will be be painted in the colloquially named " haggis and heather" scheme ( based on the Swedish "fields and meadows" scheme).
Have you considered either the SAAB Draken or Viggen for your Irish Air Corps?  I figure that the rough, mountainous Scottish terrain, particularly in the Highlands would be perfect for hiding dispersed aircraft like the Swedes do.

Please, what is this "haggis and heather" camo scheme?  I can't find pics or references to it on-line ... 

You won't find it! I made it up! .However, I intend to use a mix of brown/tan, medium/dark greens, medium /dark grey and a purplish/grey shade (probably have to mix this) over Sky undersides

[Beermonster58]

Needless to say, they will be be painted in the colloquially named " haggis and heather" scheme ( based on the Swedish "fields and meadows" scheme).
Have you considered either the SAAB Draken or Viggen for your Irish Air Corps?  I figure that the rough, mountainous Scottish terrain, particularly in the Highlands would be perfect for hiding dispersed aircraft like the Swedes do.

Please, what is this "haggis and heather" camo scheme?  I can't find pics or references to it on-line ... 

I figure that the rough, mountainous Scottish terrain, particularly in the Highlands would be perfect for hiding dispersed aircraft like the Swedes do.

Please, what is this "haggis and heather" camo scheme?  I can't find pics or references to it on-line ... 

My guess (and it's only a guess)  is that haggis and heather is Beermonster's very own  subdued mix of browns, greys, dark greens and purples.  It sounds a logical, sensible arrangement and I look forward to seeing it..............................and possibly borrowing the concept for my own use.  Will the Irish use the  "Colcannon and Guinness" variant ?

The only problem with hiding  dispersed aircraft in the lumpy bits of the Highlands is the scarcity of flat bits long enough to make suitable runways.  Possibly some of the coastal forests might be a goer.  Eire could possibly use the large barns and long straight gallops of racing stables to disperse their aircraft and hide their airbases.

You're right, I did make it up and, you're spot on with the colours. I'd be delighted to see you adopt it. For my (as yet) unbuilt Breguet Atlantic, I'll be using a different scheme -  dark grey- green(possibly slate), light grey, dark sea grey/dark blue over Sky undersides. As for the scarcity of "flat bits" , details my friend, mere details!  Where there's a "whif" , there's a way!       As an aside, I'm aware of course that the Airfix Viggen represents the early prototype but, I think it's actually better looking than the service version.

[Geoff]

The only problem with hiding  dispersed aircraft in the lumpy bits of the Highlands is the scarcity of flat bits long enough to make suitable runways. 

Lochs...................

Seaplanes.............

Even applicable to parts of Eire too.

Do I detect possible operators for the  Saro SR A1?

F-104 JATO

F-104 ZELL?

Yep

[scooter]

The only problem with hiding  dispersed aircraft in the lumpy bits of the Highlands is the scarcity of flat bits long enough to make suitable runways. 

Lochs...................

Seaplanes.............

Even applicable to parts of Eire too.

Do I detect possible operators for the  Saro SR A1?

F-104 JATO

F-104 ZELL?

Yep

Truly the "missile with a man in it" then

[Geoff]

Have you considered either the SAAB Draken or Viggen for your Irish Air Corps?  I figure that the rough, mountainous Scottish terrain, particularly in the Highlands would be perfect for hiding dispersed aircraft like the Swedes do.

Yes I did but Ireland has no real air defence system. However if they had needed/been able to afford it the Swedish Stril-60 coupled with the RBS-70 and SAAB J-32B Lansen they would have given any NATO/WARPAC country pause for thought. Also yes the J-35 Drakens would be the obvious update as they were also integrated into Strill-60 systems.

[Weaver]

Remember that Ireland's miniscule military capability is more a matter of choice than poverty. Their defence budget is currently about 0.3% of GDP and has never gone higher than 1.7%. They could quadruple it and they'd still be below the NATO target.

[Geoff]

Remember that Ireland's miniscule military capability is more a matter of choice than poverty. Their defence budget is currently about 0.3% of GDP and has never gone higher than 1.7%. They could quadruple it and they'd still be below the NATO target.

Very good point

[Rheged]

Remember that Ireland's miniscule military capability is more a matter of choice than poverty. Their defence budget is currently about 0.3% of GDP and has never gone higher than 1.7%. They could quadruple it and they'd still be below the NATO target.

Another factor is population size.  Ireland currently has a population of about 5 million.  Brief research shows that out of that population about 10% are in the age band for military service. Out of that half million, many will be ill  or in other  jobs.   This gives a very small group from whom  military personnel can be recruited.  It's no use having the best kit in the world  if you don't have the bodies to staff it!

[Beermonster58]

Remember that Ireland's miniscule military capability is more a matter of choice than poverty. Their defence budget is currently about 0.3% of GDP and has never gone higher than 1.7%. They could quadruple it and they'd still be below the NATO target.

Another factor is population size.  Ireland currently has a population of about 5 million.  Brief research shows that out of that population about 10% are in the age band for military service. Out of that half million, many will be ill  or in other  jobs.  This gives a very small group from whom  military personnel can be recruited.  It's no use having the best kit in the world  if you don't have the bodies to staff it!

Population size can of course have an impact but, maybe not as large as as you may think. Denmark and Norway are ,for example, countries of roughly equivalent populations.  Each has between 20 - 25,000 serving military personnel, not including reservists. Each country maintains an Air Force of between 100 - 120 aircraft. I do suggest therefore that the potential pool  for recruitment is quite sufficient.
Of course, they spend a lot more than Ireland so, I'd suggest that in Ireland's case perhaps political will or, lack thereof is the deciding factor ? However, I recognise that further discussion on that aspect is outside the forum rules. . In any case, thgis is Whifworld! Anything is possible!  

[Weaver]

Ignoring other political issues, the lack of enthusiasm for a big military in Ireland also fundamentally reflects a lack of need. Looking at their geographical situation, coupled with their neutrality, there's virtually no chance of them being forced into a war, so they have the luxury of being able to pick which conflicts they choose to get involved with, usually choosing to maintain the moral high ground, and the credibility of their neutrality, by supplying post-combat peace-keeping forces. To reach a situation where Ireland was forced into a war, the British mainland, with it's much bigger army, would have had to have fallen, and if the Soviets (who else?) were that powerful and successful, then Ireland having a military the size of Denmark's wouldn't save them anyway. The studies that kicked this thread off, about getting a fighter capability to defend their airspace, show that the willingness to spend money can arise quite quickly if the situation demands it.