Dassault Super Mirage G8A

[Tophe]

Thanks a very lot for this addition!
Uh... I am just surprised the 6000 did not come after the 4000...  

[Archibald]

Apparently the 2000 and 4000 were studied from 1972. But the problem is the same, because the 6000 was presented in Le Bourget in...1969!!!
I think its because the M53 program was launched in 1968. We can think that the very first drawings of the 2000/4000 date back from this era... and this probably include the 6000.  

[Tophe]

Thanks for this unknown part of the Mirage family History...
If it is (officially) untrue, let us simply say "what if...?"

After the SuperMirage and MegaMirage, let someone imagine (build?) the UltraMirage and GigaMirage...
(I have tried, with a Mirage 6000M in my Zwilling-Mirage topic: http://www.whatifmodelers.com/forum//index...=0&#entry132577 )

[Archibald]

Have you read the article on the ACF and 4000 in le Fana (July-september 2004?) Talking about the ACF they briefly mentionned that in June 1969, Aviation Magazine talked about a delta wing, mach3 Mirage. Don't know why, but I'm sure the Mega Mirage picture come from this magazine...
I made models of the G8 (starting from a Mig-23) of the ACF (from a Mirage F1) and 4000 (scratch). I think it could be easy to make a MegaMirage starting from a MiG-25...  

[Tophe]

Do you have only photocopies (as you put a question mark on the magazine issues)? I have the originals: Le Fana #416/417/418. They do not include your nice picture of MegaMirage, and I am pretty sure no older issue of this magazine includes it - I am a suscriber since #99 (with a little stop when I was student) and I bought maybe 30 of the missing issues (before #98 or near #150). I am not the complete reference but not far. Maybe JCC could tell us more? Or his contacts currently writing "Projets Français Secrets" (having refused  to cooperate with Tony Buttler on that, keeping all for their own - I fear they would not share with us either, I have such a bad experience for the Payen projects, all kept secret, preventing the poor old engineer to be celebrated worldwide before he dies )...

[Archibald]

The question mark was an error! I have too these numero of Le Fana... and they are very precious for me !
What I really want would be this famous Aviation Magazine of June 1969 which mentionne the Mirage 6000 (or Mega Mirage). alas, it must be difficult to find ( )
apparetly a model of this plane was exposed in Le bourget, 1969 but I don't know more.
"Projets Français Secrets" is a new book? Who write it? release date? what subject?
I'm deseperately seeking informations about
- the Griffon III
- SuperCaravelle
- Trident and Durandal evolutions (cut by the Mirage III)
- Mirage IVC (Forerunner of the IVA; at the time in 1956-1958, it was a heavy fighter but the III was chosen instead)
- SO-4060 Cyclone
- SNECMA Super-Atar (9000 to 12000 kgp)
As you can see, I'm very interested in French projects from the late 50's (1956-1960) but there's very few datas on them... I discovered only recnetly that the French navy have ordered a Mach2 naval fighter to Breguet in 1958, the 1120 sirocco!  

[Tophe]

Archie, do you have the 2 Docavia books of Jean Cuny about French combat aircraft projects 1944-64? I have them if you need.
Tony Buttler, after publishing his first Bristish Secret Projects books, asked me: do you know someone that could help me writing/illustrating a French Secret Projects? I forwarded the question on a French aircraft forum (that I have run away from, for years now, being badly attacked and insulted) and received just angry answers , of authors saying this subject was their own and let the British mind their own business...
I will not tell names. They were bad people. As for the Payen affair...

PS. I have many old Aviation Magazine issues, bought second hand, maybe the whole year 1969, could you tell me more precisely where to look for?

[elmayerle]

I've got a spare set of the issues of Le Fana... with the Mirage 4000 articles, including the first one that cover the Mirage G8.  If anyone is interested, drop me a PM.

[Archibald]

Tophe what you say is very interesting!
I know the book of Jean Cuny. They are available from Le Fana (I didn't bought because they are a bit expensive for me).
Your proposal is very nice but I prefer buying them on the next future (maybe  there is too much things I'm interested  for a scan)  
Is there datas about the project I mentionned, in these books? I MUST ordered it (after all, I odered the two books of Buttler)

I don't know much about this peculiar aviation magazine. apparently it was in a numero from June 1969 (I don't if Aviation Magazine was monthly or weekly so...)
There was a project of a delta wing Mirage which was presented... (not very precise I regret)
Maybe you can have a look in the June 1969 part of your AvMag collection and tell me?

[Archibald]

Well I just decided : my birthday is in one month, so I know my present now : I will order the two books by Jean Cuny !!!!!!

But I'm still interested in Aviation Magazine scans (If you found the Delta Mirage despite my weak indications)  

[Deltafan]

Hi !

It's not about "Super Mirage"  ^_^

but maybe about "Super Super Mirage" or "Super Rafale"...  


I have two olds pictures of "after" Rafale. They come from an british-french programm about an future european fighter (FACE)

I had cut the first approximately in 1997 (I don't remember if it is a british, a french or a common study) and I copied the second (Dassault study) approximately in 2000:





Does somebody know this pictures ? If yes have you the text for the first and/or an orginal photo for the second ?


Regards
Deltafan

[Zen]

First picture looks like a variation of the FOAC (later FOAS) design that was made public by BAe.

Second looks more like a earlier machine, BAe did a subsonic LO 'penetrator' aircraft as a Tornado successor, possibly as a rival to the A12 or the F117 offering.

[Deltafan]

Internet is great !  

I searched on a german forum too, and the answers (a link) came !  


http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/inde...php?topic=162.0

[pometablava]

Dear Friends Tophe and Archibald,

I have an original copy from Aviation Magazine No510 March 1969 where the Mach 3 Mirage is illustrated.

You can see some scans from advanced French projects at Overscan's forum:

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/inde...php?topic=180.0

[Tophe]

Great! Thanks a lot!
but... would this Dassault Mach 3 be named Mirage Mach 3 with such air-intakes?